Great, another bags/gear thread ;-)

[metalheart]

Being the veteran now of over half a dozen overnight bivvying trips I'm still in the thrall of taking too much (or the wrong) sub standard.

Last trip (with ScotRoutes and piemonster) saw them sans rucksack but me with.

This is partly Cy of Cotics fault (I know, the bastard) as he wouldn't drop the bottle cage on the new Solaris so with an ocelot type frame bag I can't (readily) attach a workable bottle cage. I had decided early on that the water 'solution' (it applied to my mk1 Solaris too) was a bladder in a rucksack. Also it's 'handy' for keeping my waterproofs and food readily accessible.

I've ended up with a new sleeping bag, sleep mat and bivvy bag. I sometimes feel like a Greg May fanboi as I've ended up replicating a fair bit of his set up (Ortlieb/Exped/OR/Rab) mainly coz I figured if it worked on the TD then it should work for me. Plus I've managed to obtain it all with reasonable discounts off RRP.

Tarp/poles/bivvy replaced by ForceTen Helium 2 if I'm feeling in need of more 'comfort' but it packs down reasonably small (probably not that much more than the tarp/bivy).

So far so good.

But why does everybody else manage to get everything in (what to me looks like) smaller capacity bags?

I'm also carrying a Rig7 tarp (and poles) although I've ordered a Rig3.5 (as I saw it for £24) with a couple 1m poleabear poles. I'm also eyeing up a SMD Lunar Solo for summer multi day use to solve the what do I do with my clothes/kit if just a bivvy bag conundrum).

Other kit is:
Pocket Rocket stove
MSR Ti kettle (which swallows the gas canister)
Alpkit Ti kelvin mug (holding LMF light stick, tea bags, kitchen roll & Head torch)
Après cycle jacket (took a Rab hoodie last time which wasn't warm enough but packed down less than my berghaus primaloft number... )
Spare dry thermal top, socks, u/wear
Spare tube/multi tool/levers.
Snacks (in case of emergency... )

Rucksack (osprey talon 18L) holds:
Haglofs waterproof jacket
Waterproof trousers
Camera
Phone/wallet/car key
Food (as opposed to snacks)
Spork
Toilet paper
2L camelbak bladder.

This what it looks like 'in action':


P1040007 by Colin Cadden, on Flickr


SolarisMAX all bikepacked up by Metalheart-UK, on Flickr

So, where am I going wrong?

[ScotRoutes]

Next time, we'll unpack our bags simultaneously and lay all the kit out. I don't think there's as much difference as you think. For a start, my bar bag is wider (though my seatpack seems smaller). When you repacked last time you had very little in your rucksack.

Also - you could move the bottle cage down. The Shimano DI2 battery mount should do it for you. SM-BA01.

[metalheart]

I was thinking I could probably manage more in the front pack actually... Which is why I had less in my rucksack on the Sunday (some stuff had 'migrated' to the front... ).

Come to think about all my 'reduced bulk' efforts have led to a smaller front pack size... duh.

[whitestone]

So, where am I going wrong?

You aren't You are getting out and doing stuff. Also your trips have been during the Scottish winter/spring, not exactly New Mexico or Arizona in the summer (though deserts can get cold at night). There's a bit of difference between ITTs where some discomfort might be expected and general pottering around where you can "afford" to be a little more louche I think everyone goes through the "I can't possibly do without xxx" phase before realising that they can. I'll pick and choose what to take depending on time of year, current weather, location, activity. As Colin says, so a side by side comparison.

Sometimes I'll take a Camelbak for water duties, other times I'll use a water bottle. I've a Mk1 Solaris (know what you mean about the bottle bosses) and solve the water bottle problem by using some DMR clamps, both CRC and Wiggle do them, the larger size fits the Solaris downtube. It's worth getting something like a MuckyNutz mud guard to keep the crap off the bottle.

In addition to what you have I've a couple of Alpkit Stem Cells which hold trail snacks and the like. I've generally gone the Wildcat route regarding bags/harnesses and up front have their Lion bar harness with a Lioness front pocket which can hold further snacks and trail stuff. The other main bikepacking bag makers do something similar. The main problem with these is that they can add a lot of weight to the front of the bike.

[psling]

Being the veteran now of over half a dozen overnight bivvying trips I'm still in the thrall of taking too much (or the wrong) sub standard...


So, where am I going wrong?

When you say you're taking too much do you mean you are not using everything you take or do you mean you feel you are taking too much weight?

If the first, weasel out what you don't use e.g. do you use the stove on an overnighter, do you always end up bringing food home, do you need two jackets?
If the second, it's either invest in lighter weight kit or accept that you'll be carrying a bit of weight for the comfort you require. I'm prepared to take the hit of a bit of extra weight because I don't need to move fast and I like my relative comforts. Learn from others but adapt to what you are personally prepared to accept.

I am amazed by how little some people carry but then I read the tales of their exploits and see that they snack from shops and garages, eat in pubs, and sleep in bothies. You can leave a lot of kit behind on a ride like that

[metalheart]

Well, on previous occasions I'd taken my primaloft jacket (in Oct, Dec, Jan, Feb & April) and not used it. Took a lighter weight jacket last week, needed/used it but felt a bit chilly standing around (there was a wind and we were a bit exposed on a hillside).

I definitely use my stove. Every trip. A hot drink in the am is how I roll.

Aprils trip I relied on eating out (leaving my 'emergency' sandwich in the car didn't help). As a consequence I didn't have/eat enough during the first day... Last week I had a sandwich over when I got home (and a couple of 'breakfast' scones too!).

[mechanicaldope]

Bearing in mind I have no idea what I am talking about, why do you have a mug and a kettle? Thought half the point of the mug was to act as the kettle? Guess you would need a single walled mug though.

[metalheart]

@whitestone: good point! Getting out is the main thing

I have a front accessory pack for the Ortlieb but not used it yet... Need to look at a stem cell at some point.

Definitely need to sort out a bottle for the Solaris. My mate gave me a mount whatever to drop the cage (saying that it didn't work but he'd got me one same time as for him...) should really try it...

Guess I really need to take a longer look at packing strategy and see if I can make it 'fit' better. And definitely take Colin up on his offer/advice (again).

[metalheart]

@mech/dope: I have asked myself the same question but a) I don't like the idea of brewing up in the kettle and b) I stuff the mug with stuff so only real penalty is the 'hard' shape...

I've thought about the myti mug option, might give it a whirl.

[metalheart]

When you say you're taking too much do you mean you are not using everything you take or do you mean you feel you are taking too much weight?

What I really mean is that I don't think I'm really taking a huge excess of stuff, more that everybody else seems to pack it up more discretely.... do they have Tardis bags?

My 'sleeping' stuff could be refined for sure, hence the smaller tarp ordered....

[Bearbonesnorm]

I was wondering about the cup and pot. I hardly ever take anything bigger than a 450ml mug. I'll be the first to admit that I don't do much 'cooking' but 450ml is enough water for most dehydrated meals. Everything 'cooking' related (excluding fuel) packs into the mug and the entire thing weighs less than 100g and fills the awakward space at the bottom of a seatpack.

As you say, finding a happy home for water can be an issue and not doing can have quite a knock-on effect. Have you thought about mounting a bottle to the top-tube or front of the seatpost. With water relocated, there'd be a real incentive to ditch the backpack.

[rudedog]

Kit looks fine to me. I've got a sea to summit collapsible cup that fits inside my pot along with the gas canister

The bike looks a bit on the small side for you though?

[whitestone]

Toilet paper?

Sticks and stones or a nice comfy grass tussock

Here's a shot (bit dark sorry) of my Solaris from this weekend which I was using as a bit of a shakedown for the HT550



You can see the water bottle beneath the Ocelot frame bag.

I was carrying this lot (from front to back):

Lioness:
Camera
glasses
repair kit for inflatable mat
keys (got to go somewhere)
trail snacks (peanuts, chocolate nibbles)
Exposure Joystick & retaining strap
Spare brake pads.

Lion harness with large Exped dry bag
Cumulus 150 quilt
PHD Minimus 200 bag (combine these two to give 3 season warmth)
Exped Winterlite sleeping mat
Hunka XL bivy bag
Rig7 tarp (this was for the two of us)

Stem cells
RH - MytiMug 650 with homemade meths stove & windshield, matches, folding spoon, tea bags
LH - trail snacks, flapjack and chocolate club biscuits

Ocelot
In the LH pocket are pegs and poles for the tarp plus FA kit and another repair kit for the Exped (I know, didn't realise I'd left it in there)
Main pocket - Sawyer mini water filter; small bottle of meths; pump; spare inner tube; toolkit; tyre levers; food; powerbank battery and various USB charging leads

Seat pack (8L dry bag), there was plenty of room even with all this lot in.
2prs spare socks
long sleeved thermal
thermal shorts
Microfibre towel
Buff
2 spare pairs gloves
hat
Leg warmers
Lightweight waterproof

[ScotRoutes]

Cup/kettle/pot; I'll usually take both. There's no difference in pack size as both can be filled/stuffed with other kit.

The advantage is that I can be having a hot drink while waiting for water to boil for food, or for food to be heating. It's a small "comfort" thing that has little penalty.

Also, my waterproof jacket is carried on my bar bag, via those elastics. That's one less thing to pack. And I had no waterproof trousers with me. That can be forecast dependant but I'd normally not bother or just have waterproof shorts. I don't see a trowel listed in your packing list- maybe you're hoping to find one on the trail?

[benp1]

There's a photo of my Solaris packed for 3 days and 2 nights gird from bottom in this thread - http://bearbonesbikepacking.co.uk/phpBB ... =10&t=9589

I have two bottles and a Revelate Tangle in the front triangle of a large Solaris. I have a better photo somewhere from another trip

I don't take a significantly different amount of stuff to you, food takes up a fair chunk of the space in my bags, I always take too much!

[metalheart]

I don't see a trowel listed in your packing list- maybe you're hoping to find one on the trail?

Well, you know, it's amazing what can suddenly appear at your feet...

I have Vee shaped pegs, one of them can double up for them purposes.

Oh, and the comment about my bike being on the small side? I traded up from a medium mk1 (and the new L has 6.2mm added reach over the old version!). At 6' I'm barely big enough for the large (according to the Cotic sizing chart)

Once I get the time I'll lay everything out and trial pack the options and post up photos. Might help identify any issues.

Oh, from memory, the rear pack has up to 16L and front 15L capacities.

At least I've managed to stop the back pack drooping and rubbing on the tyre...

[JohnClimber]

This is partly Cy of Cotics fault (I know, the bastard) as he wouldn't drop the bottle cage on the new Solaris so with an ocelot type frame bag I can't (readily) attach a workable bottle cage. I had decided early on that the water 'solution' (it applied to my mk1 Solaris too) was a bladder in a rucksack. Also it's 'handy' for keeping my waterproofs and food readily accessible.

These are a great bit of kit to drop your bottles on frames with bolt holes that are too high
http://www.wildcatgear.co.uk/shop/acces ... e-adapter/

[voodoo_simon]

Do the others ride rigid bikes? If so, then they'll be able to pack more in the front harness, this looking like they've got less stuff.

My rigid forks can take up to a 20l bag on the front with no interference

[ScotRoutes]

I ride rigid or front suspension, same bag/load on both.

[benp1]

Found a pic

[whitestone]

What's the rear mudguard Ben?

[metalheart]

@johnclimber: yeah, my mate gave me one of them. Need to find where I've put it and try it out.

Not sure how it'll fit with the sideswing front mech cable routing...

Ben, whats the seat tube bottle set up? A tie wrap lash up?

[benp1]

What's the rear mudguard Ben?

Zefal RM29. They're excellent, have one on each of my 29ers

[benp1]

Ben, whats the seat tube bottle set up? A tie wrap lash up?

Down tube one is lowered with a mount skidmore adaptor

Seat tube one is mounted with elite bottle cage mounts. V cheap and v secure. I don't think the white cable tie is there for structural support, but can't remember why it's there. Don't even know if it's still there... there's every chance it is! (18 months later)

[ScotRoutes]

Three set-ups, one trip

MH
P1030903 by Colin Cadden, on Flickr


PM
P1030905 by Colin Cadden, on Flickr


Me
P1030904 by Colin Cadden, on Flickr

I'm not sure there's much in it, although neither PM or I were using a rucksack. My barbag certainly looks a lot bigger in that photo (though the photo is a bit deceiving). Safe to say that my frame is quite a bit smaller than the other two too