Hand and wrist pain on very long rides - what grips?

[slarge]

Did a 12 hour race at the weekend, and after around 9 hours my hands and wrists were hurting from the constant pounding from rocks and roots. I had the same at Relentless24 last year.

I use a 29er hardtail, carbon bars (straight MT Zoom ones), kcnc foam grips, and the tyres are 2.1 inch with about 25psi. Forks are Reba 100mm. Trouble is with my riding that I don't float over stuff like the smoother riders, and the faster I go, the tighter I hold on, and the more tired/achey my hands get, the tighter I grip.

Has anyone got any suggestions? I am thinking a bigger volume front tyre, and flip the stem so I sit more upright and put less weight on my hands, but are there any decent grips or better shaped bars? The forks are renowned for not being plush, and I fitted 4 air tokens to help this, but I think they might be due an upgrade.

What wisdom is out there?

(I was pretty chuffed to come 2nd in the race by the way)

[Lawmanmx]

ive had all this pain recently on my ride to and from Bearstock, things are looking up since i fitted Stooge moto bars and Ergon grips (at the correct angle) i have only done short rides since fitting these but all seems really good up to now

[Bearbonesnorm]

Steve, do you find the problem is worse on courses / rides that are more technical as opposed to those where you're seated for longer periods?

[slarge]

Yes Stu, it is a lumpy bumpy course problem - if the course was smooth I would have no issue.

[SteveM]

some interesting thoughts here

http://jeffsbike.blogspot.co.uk

[Bearbonesnorm]

Yes Stu, it is a lumpy bumpy course problem - if the course was smooth I would have no issue.

In that case, it might be more to do with your stance / position on the bike when you're stood than tyres, grips or bars.

Open nutshell ... We have a tendancy to support ourselves with our hands in these situations which is usually caused by our self-preservation instincts telling us to move our weight rearwards away from what it perceives as the 'danger'.

Ideally, your cranks want to be dead level (I know that sounds obvious but watch most people descent and their rear crank will be dropped by 10 - 20 degrees) Now you have a stable platform to stand on, aim to have your knees only slightly bent (this will relieve the pressure on your quads) and your weight equally supported through both feet. Your body should feel like it's at 12 o'clock in relation to the BB at 6 o'clock. In this position it should be possible to lift your hands off the bars a few mm without feeling like you're going to fall either forwards or backwards.

I should say, standing like this will feel odd at first. You'll feel very high and nearer the front than you're used to but you soon become accustomed to it ... close nutshell

EDIT: Oh and congratulations, superb result

[Lawmanmx]

some interesting thoughts here

http://jeffsbike.blogspot.co.uk

Fantastic that Steve ... and it explains perfectly why i never feel comfortable in my helmet, and i used to ride with no peak up to last year, i seem to forget things very easily these days tho

[GregMay]

I'd add to Stu -
1) Ditch the straight bars, puts your wrist in a very abnormal position biomechanically unless you're running quite narrow bars. A bit of sweep is your friend.
2) learn to relax your hands and let them float on the bar - simple test - can you ride a trail with a Bic Biro between your palm and the bars without crushing it?If not, you need to relax your grip.
3) Check your suspension... and if not doing it, one finger brake, and get better at breaking less and later.

[Alpinum]

Yes Stu, it is a lumpy bumpy course problem - if the course was smooth I would have no issue.

Here's a lumpy bumpy lover
My setup has slightly long reach on the frame, but a short stem (don't know why I'm saying this - short stems are just more fun on the rough and techy stuff).
Handlebars at 750 mm - would go wider, but then have to balance the issues when riding exposed trails past trees and rocks etc.
On DH bike 760 - 780 mm - very lumpy bumpy. I'm 182 cm tall, ape like arms. Some may think it's silly to go wide, but then on rough terrain you get less fatigue. Give it a try, it's a revelation for rough stuff.
9 ° backsweep and 5° up, turned 'till it felt right (tested and adjusted on many rides) and equally distributed. A lightish carbon bar can help to take out the sharp little peaks. Don't try RaceFace Sixc - they're stiff and feel harsh. Like most 35 mm bars.
Have the fork tuned. It's amasing what a good tuner can get out of your (even shortish travel) fork. I'd rather invest for a good tuning than get a new one for 2-3x the price. Unless the fork is completely worn out.
2.4" tires (they win on bumpy lumpy - there's absolutely no reason to run narrower tires - they are not faster) and a wide rim (though there's a limit to it). Tires like Conti X-King in 2.4" start to loose their (already weak) edge and respond accordingly when commiting in turns when the rim's closer to 35 than 30 mm internally.
Run tubeless or Latex tubes for more compliance. Mostly 1.4-1.8 bar should do, depending on terrain (on proper offroad less pressure equals more absolute speed and is less tiring too), riding style, tires and rims.

I like Stu's advice about

In this position it should be possible to lift your hands off the bars a few mm without feeling like you're going to fall either forwards or backwards.

is spot on.

Twist your wrist.
Twist it upwards, don't let it hang. You want a straight line from the lower arm into the hand. When getting out of the saddle for a sprint, climb etc. move wrists too as you transfer your upper body.

Core strength. On long rides this really helps too.

I've broken my lower radius once, my scaphoid twice and shattered the triquetrum once (damaging the TFCC and fracturing the ulnar styloid in doing so) all on the right side.
Yet, with the proper riding position (as suggested before) and some help of the contact points I can ride a full rigid bike on rough terrain for ages without pain

p.s. I ride Pro Koryak grips on all bikes.

[slarge]

This is all really useful stuff, I will give it a go.

Doing more technical off road riding will help, as the vast majority of my riding hours are on the road, and I do take a while to settle into off road riding, and many techniques (like steering with the hips) are not subconscious yet.

I have been thinking of a skills course for a while, maybe this is a good kickstart....

Thanks all

[Bearbonesnorm]

I have been thinking of a skills course for a while, maybe this is a good kickstart....

Maybe I should consider running a coaching day for Bear Boners?

[Gari]

I'd be up for that, been thinking about it for a while now, maybe a 2 day course though? Given how far I need to travel!

[fatbikephil]

+1 for increasing core strength. I've been doing tons of work on core muscles trying to sort my back issues and its made a big difference to bike comfort as I can sit easily with minimal wrist pressure. Short stems and high bars as well.

[Mpolo]

+2 for a coaching sesh Meraid was thinking of asking

[slarge]

Stu
I would be up for a skills day. Happy to pay for good tuition, and if it became a bivvy ride as well it would be a bonus.......

[Scattamah]

Another one up for a skills day...been meaning to get off my arse and do this for ages. Might even be able to keep up with folks around here with some new tricks in the bag.

Back on topic, ever since TD2014, I have very sensitive ulnar nerves and it doesn't take much for them to fire off and get my pinkies tingling, sometimes just a few hours. I have to stay conscious that I'm not leaning too far forward and keep my weight back. Often forget and then the hand issues rear up. Have tried Ergon GP2, round grips and keep coming back to the Bonty Evolve ergo grips which are a nice half way between.

Greetz

S.