Exposure Diablo, Zenith or Joystick?
Not sure what the tiny intricacies of detail difference are, except that Diablo has a big head.
For the helmet.
Current ones look incredibly smart.
Cheaper option is the AMMP by Cateye (excellent spread of light and throw compared to the Exposure TORO and Strada). But it's about 150g and then the mount on top I'd imagine is heavy for the neck muscles. There were reports of a goPro option but can't find that for em (the Cateye AMMP).

I was always cynical about the joystick but picked one up in an Evans sale and it's impressed me

Obviously if you are walking like John Wayne after trying that saddle I sold you......you may want to discount my view

Joysticks are very good. Diablo better in terms of light but a bit more bulk, weight and dosh.

What he said. Either is good, probably depends when you want to use it and whether with another light.

Yes... main light will still be on the bars. This will hopefully help manage any undulations and also help spot potential bivy spots for the BAM...

Joystick to supplement a bar light
Diablo if its your only light

I've got a mk12 Joystick (1000 lumens) and a mk8 Diablo (1400 lumens). The Joystick seems to have a smaller, more concentrated spot of light, the Diablo a bit of a wider spread. In use, I much prefer the Joystick on my head - it's lighter, and the concentrated spot helps in terms of illuminating where I'm looking. Either on their own seems to be bright enough for me to ride my local trails (generally steep and rocky/tech, not so much full-on speed stuff).

I sold my diablo and kept my joystick when i had two headlights. I preferred the spottier beam when I was running a bar light (6 pack in my case)

The Zenith has a much bigger battery so that's a big plus. I used a diablo on my bars for trips with more daylight when I didn't expect to ride at night much (like the WRT)

BUT, the beam pattern does vary through the years, I think the joystick had a couple of years when it was floodier. My joystick has a smooth reflector and my diablo has a dimpled lens to make it floodier

Mk15 joystick here. I like it

Tried a Joystick, Axis and Diablo - thought they were all horribly disappointing for how much they cost.

Been running a £30 Moon vortex pro for the last two winters, 1300 lumens, a better beam pattern than the Diablo (for a helmet) and more control on light modes. Also has a replaceable battery.

rudedog wrote: ↑Wed Mar 01, 2023 7:08 pm Tried a Joystick, Axis and Diablo - thought they were all horribly disappointing for how much they cost.

Been running a £30 Moon vortex pro for the last two winters, 1300 lumens, a better beam pattern than the Diablo (for a helmet) and more control on light modes. Also has a replaceable battery.

Interesting - I bought a couple of moon tail lights in the Rutland BYGOF deal that Dave posted on the bargain thread and I'm mightily impressed - bright as and crucially, a good switch, unlike exposure traces. £30 for a lid light is hard to beat....

Sorry, it was actually £34

https://www.leisurelakesbikes.com/acces ... wkQAvD_BwE

The switch on this is actually the one thing that’s not so great, can be difficult to locate in gloves.

Tried a Joystick, Axis and Diablo - thought they were all horribly disappointing for how much they cost.

Been running a £30 Moon vortex pro for the last two winters, 1300 lumens, a better beam pattern than the Diablo (for a helmet) and more control on light modes. Also has a replaceable battery.

Interesting - I bought a couple of moon tail lights in the Rutland BYGOF deal that Dave posted on the bargain thread and I'm mightily impressed - bright as and crucially, a good switch, unlike exposure traces. £30 for a lid light is hard to beat....
[/quote]

Not £30 anymore Phil. More like about £80 I thnk. Seems like I may end up giving the AMMP 800 or 1100 a shot. Especially since my 300 AMMP is comparable and better than the throw the TORO or Strada would give me - only lasts 3 hours but is usb chargeable and the beam has to be seen to be believed.

I've heard very good stories about MOON and their build quality before too.

Decisions... decisions.

rudedog wrote: ↑Thu Mar 02, 2023 12:03 am Sorry, it was actually £34

https://www.leisurelakesbikes.com/acces ... wkQAvD_BwE

The switch on this is actually the one thing that’s not so great, can be difficult to locate in gloves.

Oops... Oops... Oops...

Quick, quick... quickety-quick.

Go click n buy it before it goes out of stock...

Lol... Bought... Phew...

(USB C too... Good find that there RudeDog..).

Interestingly at my club some are quite happy riding chinese front bar lights (incl. me) but when it comes to helmet lights, everyone has exposures. Until last week I was using a joystick mk7 400 lumen light and that was fine. However, last week I tried out my Mk14 1050 lumen and that was lovely Do I need the Mk14 instead of the Mk4 is an interesting question. I bought the Mk14 some time ago when it was heavily reduced and I dare say it's nice having the ability to whack the power up and the charge may well last longer but I never felt underlit or dangerous with the Mk7. I was chatting to a friend last week who has a diablo on his lid and he was saying it's nice having the extra power but I personally will just contiue with the joysticks and have no need for any more illumination.

Are there any good cheaper alternatives to something like the Expsorure Torro?

At some point I must take the rigid out on a club night and see how the Son dynamo hub and K2 light fare.

Lifeline Pavo from CRC is 3500 lumens - £90 with code

https://www.chainreactioncycles.com/mob ... prod211290

After trying many different options for a helmet light, I'm currently using a Nitecore HC 68 headtorch which attaches to my helmet with reusable zip ties. It has loads of different settings and the ability to fine tune the beam between spot and flood. I use it in combination with an Exposure Toro on the bars and find it very good for riding technical trails in the dark. Probably overkill for bikepacking though.