• Bikerafting with children?

Posted: **Tue Aug 09, 2022 2:35 pm**

Hello,

I'm new on this forum. My name is Johnny and I'm British but I live in Belgium. I've been bikepacking for a few years, mostly overnight & weekends. I try to get out at least once a month if possible.
Been lurking on here for a while and have decided to join properly.

I'm bikerafting curious, and I'm trying to find a bikerafting setup that I can use both solo and with my son who's 8 years old.
I'm 188cm tall, sit length is about 120cm. I have a single speed mtb with 27.5x3" tyres. My son is 140cm. He currently rides a bike with 24" wheels. He can already kayak and is a good swimmer. We would mostly do trips on flat water.

I'm trying to work out if it's better to go with a 2 person or a 1 person or 1+1 packraft.

Current possibilities are the following:

- Buy a 1 person packraft for now and then add another for the boy later if he wants. Try to stack our two bikes on the front/rear of the raft. I've been looking at the GP Cargo for this.
- Buy a one person packraft. Use a Brompton or mini velo for me, take the boy's full bike. Again, I'm looking at the GP Cargo raft for this. I've got an old Brompton that's knackered from a few years commuting, so I could use it but would need some money to get it back on the road. I've seen some cheap single speed mini velos for sale second hand, probably less than it would cost to fix the Brompton tbh.
- Buy a smallish 2 person packraft like the Anfibio Sigma. That seems small enough that it could still work solo, but maybe big enough to carry two bikes.

I'm quite interested in the mini velo possibility because it seems you could carry it on a packraft without removing the wheels. Not so much use off road though, of course.

I asked a couple of packraft sellers and got completely contradictory advice from them. One said go for an Anfibio Delta MX, the other said go for a full size 2 person packraft, but the model he proposed is huge (220cm inner length) and would be impossible to use solo.

Cheers,
Johnny

Posted: **Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:27 pm**

I have no particular experience so this is a total guess.

2 person packraft, towing something (potentially quite naff) with all the bikes etc in. I think it's a tall ask for a raft that can do 1 or 2 people and both bikes. Don't know tho

Posted: **Tue Aug 09, 2022 3:47 pm**

He'll be along in a minute

Posted: **Tue Aug 09, 2022 9:36 pm**

He'll be along in a minute

Allen... send him a textessage will ya
__________
In other news... welcome to the forum and interested to see what bikepacking Belgium looks like. Have you considered joining the BAM (Bivy a Month) thread. There's also a thread om how to insert photos to being your adventures to life.

I'm Shafiq btw and I was probably in a similar case as yourself many years ago (forum here curious). It's a lovely place where everyone kind of gets on and (kindof) agrees to diaagree and continue showing respect to one another. I've learnt loads by usingy big mouth to ask questions. Though sometimes I think I should stop as Mrs/Ms/Miss* Lindley in junior school used to say, "Jack the lad, engage brain before opening mouth".

*Only thought to clarify that cos Ms/Miss/Mrs Saluk in my first year/class of same school (horrible cow, always mad at me, I think I know why) told me "DON'T YOU MISS ME. All for using the term Miss/Mrs/Ms... Who'd have thought!!

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:09 pm**

I'm here don't panic you lot

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 1:26 pm**

Filetagebelge wrote: ↑Tue Aug 09, 2022 2:35 pm Hello,

I'm new on this forum. My name is Johnny and I'm British but I live in Belgium. I've been bikepacking for a few years, mostly overnight & weekends. I try to get out at least once a month if possible.
Been lurking on here for a while and have decided to join properly.

I'm bikerafting curious, and I'm trying to find a bikerafting setup that I can use both solo and with my son who's 8 years old.
I'm 188cm tall, sit length is about 120cm. I have a single speed mtb with 27.5x3" tyres. My son is 140cm. He currently rides a bike with 24" wheels. He can already kayak and is a good swimmer. We would mostly do trips on flat water.

I'm trying to work out if it's better to go with a 2 person or a 1 person or 1+1 packraft.

Current possibilities are the following:

- Buy a 1 person packraft for now and then add another for the boy later if he wants. Try to stack our two bikes on the front/rear of the raft. I've been looking at the GP Cargo for this.
- Buy a one person packraft. Use a Brompton or mini velo for me, take the boy's full bike. Again, I'm looking at the GP Cargo raft for this. I've got an old Brompton that's knackered from a few years commuting, so I could use it but would need some money to get it back on the road. I've seen some cheap single speed mini velos for sale second hand, probably less than it would cost to fix the Brompton tbh.
- Buy a smallish 2 person packraft like the Anfibio Sigma. That seems small enough that it could still work solo, but maybe big enough to carry two bikes.

I'm quite interested in the mini velo possibility because it seems you could carry it on a packraft without removing the wheels. Not so much use off road though, of course.

I asked a couple of packraft sellers and got completely contradictory advice from them. One said go for an Anfibio Delta MX, the other said go for a full size 2 person packraft, but the model he proposed is huge (220cm inner length) and would be impossible to use solo.

Cheers,
Johnny

I've the Aplacka Caribou and the GP Cargo, both at the only bike carrying specific packrafts available to the UK market.
The Caribou will be too short for what you want.

Go for the GP Cargo
with the code GP_Cargo_John you get another 6% off your order
https://www.packrafting-store.de/New/GP ... anguage=en

It's longer length means that you can carry more gear on the top and in the foot well where you feet go and it's much larger rear end can carry stuff on top too.
Or even carry a smaller passenger up front, you can't do any of these on the Caribou which is 33% more expensive too.

It have D rings down the side, which I hate and would cut off, but it's the only fault in it's design.

I would highly recommend buying and taking the €10 hand pump with you, as blowing in to inflate it to the high pressure needed to keep the packraft rigid is almost impossible with human lungs
https://www.packrafting-store.de/Access ... ::913.html

I'd also buy one of these to inflate it much quicker and with less faff than the inflation bag, plus it great to remove out all of the air from it helps pack it down smaller too.
https://www.amazon.co.uk/FLEXTAILGEAR-P ... C5PL&psc=1

Don't forget your PFD
https://www.packrafting-store.de/Floata ... :::76.html

And this is a great paddle too
https://www.packrafting-store.de/Paddle ... ::603.html

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:07 pm**

Hello,

Thanks a lot for the suggestions!

@Cheeky Monkey - I've got a very naff inflatable boat that I could try out for towing gear in.

@Shafiq - thanks for the welcome. Belgium is great for short bikepacking trips. There's a network of free bivouac sites (bivakzone.be). There's even one in the forest <10km from me so I could cheat a bit with bivy a month

@John - this is really very helpful, just the advice I was looking for. One more thing: I've seen a Nortik Trekraft (no deck version) for sale 2nd hand for €530 near me. Is this a reasonable alternative to the GP Cargo for a beginner? (It's a bit of a compromise in terms of carrying capacity obviously but it leaves some budget to get my boy his own packraft later if he really wants).

Cheers,
Johnny

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:38 pm**

Filetagebelge wrote: ↑Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:07 pm One more thing: I've seen a Nortik Trekraft (no deck version) for sale 2nd hand for €530 near me. Is this a reasonable alternative to the GP Cargo for a beginner? (It's a bit of a compromise in terms of carrying capacity obviously but it leaves some budget to get my boy his own packraft later if he really wants).

Cheers,
Johnny

No avoid any packraft with a pointed front end, these are unstable with heavy wide loads fixed to the front of the packraft.

Take a look at the front of the GP Cargo and the Caribou and their wide front ends and you will see what I mean.

Unless you are a confident paddler that is.

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:48 pm**

Ok, thanks. That also rules out several of the other rafts I was looking at (Anfibio Delta or Sigma, Current-Raft Shoreline).

So I think we have a winner in the GP Cargo. I kind of hoped that would be the case because it looks like a really useful design with room on the rear as well as the front.

Cheers,
Johnny

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:06 pm**

I think one of the primary things I learnt about rafts is - it's not cheap. It can be done cheaper but that then limits what you're able to (safely) do and those limits are very quickly surpassed by ambition.

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 3:15 pm**

Filetagebelge wrote: ↑Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:48 pm Ok, thanks. That also rules out several of the other rafts I was looking at (Anfibio Delta or Sigma, Current-Raft Shoreline).

So I think we have a winner in the GP Cargo. I kind of hoped that would be the case because it looks like a really useful design with room on the rear as well as the front.

Cheers,
Johnny

Good call, don't forget the discount code for the extra 6%

Posted: **Wed Aug 10, 2022 4:36 pm**

Filetagebelge wrote: ↑Wed Aug 10, 2022 2:48 pm Ok, thanks. That also rules out several of the other rafts I was looking at (Anfibio Delta or Sigma, Current-Raft Shoreline).

So I think we have a winner in the GP Cargo. I kind of hoped that would be the case because it looks like a really useful design with room on the rear as well as the front.

Cheers,
Johnny

Just to add Johnny. If you click JonClimbers profile then look at his previous posts. He did a massive article reviewing 2 of his packrafts. I reckon you might find a bunch of useful extra knowlwdge in that post too (i will try and find/link it later if you can't see it).

Posted: **Thu Aug 11, 2022 12:02 pm**

@Redefined Cycles - Thanks. Anfibio has a link to John Climber's article via the GP Cargo page on their site. John's photos are useful - especially seeing what it looks like when sitting in the boat with the bike on the front. Much better than all the silly 'lifestyle' shots you get on places like bikepacking.com.

Cheers,
Johnny

Posted: **Mon Aug 15, 2022 1:17 pm**

Filetagebelge wrote: ↑Thu Aug 11, 2022 12:02 pm @Redefined Cycles - Thanks. Anfibio has a link to John Climber's article via the GP Cargo page on their site. John's photos are useful - especially seeing what it looks like when sitting in the boat with the bike on the front. Much better than all the silly 'lifestyle' shots you get on places like bikepacking.com.

Cheers,
Johnny

The hand pump is almost essential

Without the pump and only topped up with lung power in warm weather most packrafts deflate a little.
You can see it here next to V's elbow

Lesson learnt for the next trip out

This photo shows the short lengthed Alpacka Caribou in action

Posted: **Mon Aug 15, 2022 10:52 pm**

Oi John, are you saying I'm fat??!?

Posted: **Tue Aug 16, 2022 9:23 am**

Just to throw in my 2p worth. I have a longshore 280 which is a 2 person raft, it is cramped for my legs with my 4yo in the front and I wouldn't be happy putting a bike on with him in there as it would cover where he sits. If I was seriously considering bike rafting for 2 with a single raft I would look at the alpacka forager with the seats that let you paddle it as a canoe as its designed for big loads ( big game hunting in the alaskan wilderness). The issue would be 1 price and 2 its at the heavy end of the spectrum so would really want to be on a rack on a bike.

Posted: **Tue Aug 16, 2022 3:08 pm**

Hello Alec,

Thanks for that. A couple of packraft sites have also advised me to go for a full size two person raft if I want to bring 2 bikes and a child.
I've also looked at John Climber's pictures again, and it doesn't look ideal to have a kid in the front with the bike hanging over him. He won't be able to paddle that way.

However, I've decided to go for the GP Cargo and get a second raft for my son a bit later. I might try the Anfibio Nano, the Klymit Litewater or maybe Decathlon's effort.
The Anfibios are out of stock just now so I'll have to wait til next month anyway.

A full 2 person raft seems a bit much if I want to do solo tours as well as trips with the boy.

Cheers,
Johnny

Posted: **Wed Aug 17, 2022 10:22 am**

The Anfibios are out of stock just now so I'll have to wait til next month anyway

Do you know if the new stock will still have the line of D rings down each side?

I know John said there was a way to arrange them so they didn't foul so much on the paddlestroke but personally I'd just prefer them not to be there.

Just curious

Posted: **Wed Aug 17, 2022 10:11 pm**

@Cheeky Monkey,

The GP Cargo is still in stock. That's the one with the problematic D-rings.
The Anfibio Nano and Nano RTC are both out of stock for now.

Cheers,
Johnny

Posted: **Thu Aug 18, 2022 10:20 am**

Filetagebelge wrote: ↑Wed Aug 17, 2022 10:11 pm @Cheeky Monkey,

The GP Cargo is still in stock. That's the one with the problematic D-rings.
The Anfibio Nano and Nano RTC are both out of stock for now.

Cheers,
Johnny

Comprendo, gracias!

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