Hello all,

I am looking for some "new bike" advice.

I attended "Gravel Tro Breizh" in northern France about a month ago, a 1260km event with a mix of gravel, MTB and road riding. Took me about 7 days and beat me up pretty good.

So I have been wondering how to make my longer rides more comfortable. My current bike is a not very fancy aluminium hardtail and I would prefer to stay with the hardtails, rigid fork if possible.

Now, on the ride I spotted quite a few titanium bikes and there has always been talk about alu being harsh and titanium/steel more comfy. And these riders to my eyes looked pretty comfy. Could be they are just more tough than me, but I have had a look around and came across Smokestone Bikes in Abbeymead, Gloucester.

Any of you got experience with their bikes? I am looking at "Mr Harry's Flatmate" in particular. Is it a smooth riding distance bike? Lot of money to get a titanium frame, - are they worth it. Any other suggestions?

Thanks

In my experience frame material matters far less than frame design ... it's possible to make a good or bad frame from any material.

I'd also say that comfort is most often a combination of many things and simple stuff like tyre volume / pressure, grips, bars, saddle, etc will often have a far greater effect than the frame itself (we can obviously exclude suspension frames here). Consider things like bar and seatpost diameter here too.

Rigid forks can also vary wildly in their ride quality and can make a good frame feel awful.

Ooh - Graham's bikes seem very well thought of if you are considering a Smokestone.

i have always found a frame with some flex to be the comfiest to ride.
i own a Ti fargo, which is very comfy, and has some flex with my weight riding it.
years ago i had a reynolds 953 tubed rock lobster hardtail. by far the comfiest frame i have ever ridden.

Compare what you've seen to quality steel offerings e.g. Shand. Call them and describe what you're after, as the weld up the frames in Scotland and can offer custom options. Worth shopping around.
I've had, and still have steel, Ti and carbon frames. for a hardtail (if not going for race lightweight) I prefer metal. In terms of comfort, there's little difference between steel and Ti, especially with the correct geometry, contact points and tyres.

I think what gets underestimated in frame design when it comes to comfort is torsional flex, the frame twisting or flexing along its length. Frames have very little give in the purely vertical sense (rear triangle flex is hardly worth thinking about) but there's a lot of variation in torsional stiffness between a stiff frame and a zingy/flexy frame. As a massive generalisation Ti bikes on average, based on common Ti tube specs, are less torsionally stiff than modern hydroform tubed Alu bikes. That twist can make a bike much less tiring to ride over rough ground. It can make it a bit of a noodle when loaded up though, prone to shimmy. Getting the balance right is difficult as we all have riding style preferences, different levels of strength and expectations, loading preference etc.

Have you considered carbon?

My Trek Procaliber is way more comfortable than any previous steel bike I’ve had and that’s with similar setups, it’s even more comfortable than my Salsa El mariachi and we all know what kind of following they have too

The trek is designed to have a bit of flex in the rear end, I don’t notice it whilst riding but I do later on when I don’t feel so ‘beat up’.

Of course tweaking tyre pressures, widths, seat post/saddles will always have an effect (or is that affect?) on a bike and not just the frame. My old voodoo wanga singlespeed would ride well with the tyres at 30PSI or so, at 40psi the bike felt faster but reality, it was probably just harsher and more importantly, my back was in bits the next day at 40psi. Lessons learnt pretty quick on the one to drop tyre pressures

Lauf forks made the biggest difference for me in terms of not getting beaten up on long multiday rides - they're a lot more comfortable than rigid or telescopic.

I've got two hardtails with Ti frames and they're both very comfortable rides and very light. One frame's a Titus from Planet X which cost about £600, the other's a custom from Travers which cost £1900. There's not a great deal of difference in ride quality between them tbh so you don't necessarily need to spend a fortune on the frame.

As other people have said forks, tyre volume/pressure, riding position and bars make the biggest difference wrt comfort, but Ti frames are lovely so go for it.

edit - might be worth keeping an an eye PX for them getting Silk Road frames back in https://www.planetx.co.uk/i/q/FRTISILKR ... bike-frame

Thanks a lot for all the answers, lots to think about.

I will look up the lauf forks and the procaliber, although I have always avoided carbon. Issues around PF30 bottom brackets and the ease of changing threaded ones. Maybe that is not an issue anymore. I will also give Shand a call. I had a look at their website and started thinking about rohloff hubs! Any thoughts on rohloffs???

I'll be back

Cheers

If I am reading the HT 550 results correctly it was 'won' by a Frenchman riding a FS Chinese carbon framed bike.
They appear to do hard tail versions and a reasonably priced seat post in the correct size for me.
Look on the Ali-Express website as the European one seems to have sold out of most things.

Mariner wrote: ↑Sat Jun 04, 2022 9:04 am If I am reading the HT 550 results correctly it was 'won' by a Frenchman riding a FS Chinese carbon framed bike.
They appear to do hard tail versions and a reasonably priced seat post in the correct size for me.
Look on the Ali-Express website as the European one seems to have sold out of most things.

Huw Oliver definitely isn't French

Huw and Angus Young both had tracker problems so their finish time is wrong.

Substandard off this forum has a Mr Harry and may be able to offer advice on what it's like. I've had two Smokestone fat bike frames (one aluminium and my new one which is titanium) and I've been delighted with both of them. The ti fat bike frame is noticeably more compliant than the alu frame was which surprised me a bit as I thought that the fat tyres would mask any differences. Interestingly I also went from an aluminium Sonder Camino to the ti version and noticed less difference between the two which suggests that merely going from an aluminium frame to ti frame may not always have the result that you expect.

maxap wrote: ↑Sat Jun 04, 2022 7:41 am Thanks a lot for all the answers, lots to think about.

I will look up the lauf forks and the procaliber, although I have always avoided carbon. Issues around PF30 bottom brackets and the ease of changing threaded ones. Maybe that is not an issue anymore. I will also give Shand a call. I had a look at their website and started thinking about rohloff hubs! Any thoughts on rohloffs???

I'll be back

Cheers

Just so happens I've got rigid Ti frame and Rohloff.

I had a steel Genisis Longitude before the Ti frame. Can't think I ever thought the steel frame was uncomfortable but I did notice the Ti had a bit more spring to it when I first started riding it which does take the sting out of rougher trails.

As mentioned above though when loaded it does have a bit of a noodle feel but only when you quickly wiggle the bars side to side. The steel frame did this as well mind you but I never really notice this as you don't really wiggle the bars like that while riding.

Rohloff is up there as one of the best bike purchases I've done. Love it on the rigid. Good gear range, shifting without pedaling and zero hassle.

Wouldn't have one on a trail bike though due to the weight being at the back end and the grip shift. You have to move your hand slightly off the grip after shifting to get back in the same position.

Got my frame made via http://www.spanner.org.uk/ so that I could specify exactly what I wanted.

also on a rigid Ti bike with a rohloff.

salsa fargo ti, which i just love to bits.
as for the rohloff, i am still undecided. which is a bit odd really. done 8k miles on it in 14 months. and it has not been a minutes trouble. just been for a service while the rim on the wheel was changed as it had split. kill 2 birds with one stone kind of thing. i have considered selling the rohloff set up. if anyone is interested feel free to pm me.

Big Rohloff fan here.
My oldest is more than 20years old and still running faultlessly. Wouldn’t want to run anything else on a bikepacking bike.

ton wrote: ↑Sat Jun 04, 2022 8:20 pm also on a rigid Ti bike with a rohloff.

salsa fargo ti, which i just love to bits.
as for the rohloff, i am still undecided. which is a bit odd really. done 8k miles on it in 14 months. and it has not been a minutes trouble. just been for a service while the rim on the wheel was changed as it had split. kill 2 birds with one stone kind of thing. i have considered selling the rohloff set up. if anyone is interested feel free to pm me.

What is it that makes you want to sell the Rohloff?

For bike pack bimbling I just can't fault it...

A bit left field. A while ago I saw a Pinion geared HT. It was in a mate's bike workshop and he'd been given it in lieu of servicing payments! I think it may have been a custom Sonder but don't hold me to that. What was weird was when you picked it up it was slightlyfront heavy due to the forks and no derailleur.

My main bikepacking bike is a rigid Cotic Solaris (Mk 1). If you get your fit sorted then it's fine over the rough stuff - I did the HT550 on it a few years ago. I've since fitted a wide rim front wheel with a Vittoria Mezcal 2.6" tyre to offer some cushioning, this was for the French Divide, it's not a wet conditions tyre though but anything like that, or even a 3" tyre would offer similar benefits.

What is it that makes you want to sell the Rohloff?

i am not 100% sure mate.
just had a week away touring in northumberland. i did not take the rohloff equipped bike as i had no rear rack to fit it.
so i rode a specialized rockhopper, with the forks locked out and a 1 x 9 set up.
the gear changes are just so much quicker and easier on a standard set up. but to keep it so quick and good you need to maintain it. that is where i fall down.
the rohloff has not been touched for 14 month. until the rim split, hence the service whilst bike rim was swapped.
i have thought of selling it, but i know i would regret it straight away.

whitestone wrote: ↑Fri Jun 10, 2022 8:43 pm A bit left field. A while ago I saw a Pinion geared HT. It was in a mate's bike workshop and he'd been given it in lieu of servicing payments! I think it may have been a custom Sonder but don't hold me to that. What was weird was when you picked it up it was slightlyfront heavy due to the forks and no derailleur.

My main bikepacking bike is a rigid Cotic Solaris (Mk 1). If you get your fit sorted then it's fine over the rough stuff - I did the HT550 on it a few years ago. I've since fitted a wide rim front wheel with a Vittoria Mezcal 2.6" tyre to offer some cushioning, this was for the French Divide, it's not a wet conditions tyre though but anything like that, or even a 3" tyre would offer similar benefits.

I'm a big fan of Olsen bikes. Ti frames, pinion gearbox, belt drive. Spacing for all kinds of axles. Lots of innovation all packed into one frame (of which there are several types. Steve is a really approachable chap too, I've had quite a few conversations with him over the years.

As some have noted on another thread, his website is a little bit tricky to navigate - https://olsenbikes.co.uk/

Couldn’t find them but do Olsen do frame only ? Very nice bikes

I'm quite sure he would do frame only.

Is the Jones frame still on eBay?

Hello again,

I seem to have been going round in a great big circle in my search for a hardtail. I am now back at Smokestone's Mr Harry's Flatmate, due to my preference for non-slack 2x bike setups. I realised that 1x was big now but had no idea 2x was near mission impossible. Are you all riding 1x??? Anyway, Mr Harry's Flatmate takes a front derailleur, so all good. Or so I thought. It turns out that Smokestone Bikes no longer ships internationally, - and I live in France now .......
See ya

All my mtb's are 1x, yes.

I mostly ride 1x1 but have 1 2x9 and 1 3x8 mtbs