Found out about this over on the other place (which is a bit galling for a start since I'm a paid subscriber and they haven't bothered emailing me). Basically Viewranger have merged with another mapping called Outdoor Active, and now the app and associated map subscriptions are being discontinued and replaced by Outdoor Active, which as far as I can see is at the moment inferior.

I'm pretty annoyed because I use VR on a dedicated phone as my primary navigation tool, and have done for years. I've also invested in maps which I bought outright before there was a subscription model. The app won't just disappear overnight, but sure as night follows day it will eventually stop working. I'm genuinely sad about this.

Apologies to anyone on here I recommended VR to, as I tended to do any time a thread on the subject came up. I didn't see this coming.

There's some details here: https://mailchi.mp/outdooractive/viewra ... df026e8cb4

You can read me and other people moaning about it on STW if you really want: https://singletrackworld.com/forum/topi ... or-active/

I only use it view OS maps around my location and pick where to go next / check where my current track goes off to..
On first look at the new app. It lets me do that, Tell's me I have all maps available for download included as I am a pro (nice of it)

So, looks ok for me. So far.

That's pretty annoying as I too use Viewranger for navigation on my phone.

Backcountry Navigator.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... or.license

I never got on with viewranger as the desktop app was pish. OS far better on the desktop and nearly as good on the smart phone apart from the downloading function which is a right faff.

This is rather saddening. I think I have about £200 or more invested in the various OS maps on there (both 1 in 25 and 1 in 50). Another load of money down the drain. Happened before for some reason with the official OS map which won't allow me to see the areas I'd bought cos (maybe) I'd not used em in so long...

oh well...

redefined_cycles wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:31 pm This is rather saddening. I think I have about £200 or more invested in the various OS maps on there (both 1 in 25 and 1 in 50). Another load of money down the drain. Happened before for some reason with the official OS map which won't allow me to see the areas I'd bought cos (maybe) I'd not used em in so long...

oh well...

I feel your pain, I’d bought several hundred pounds worth of OS map tiles with the original OS app, the terms gave me access in perpetuity apparently. Not much use when they didn’t update the app and it just crashed on launch. They didn’t even carry over your tiles to the new platform, utter bastards.
Thankfully with ViewRanger I’ve stuck to a subscription fearing, rightly getting shafted again.
It really makes me angry that I actually pay for a product rather than stealing it via the internet get treated like sub standard. If I buy a book on Amazon I own it forever. Quite why OS are able to get away with it is beyond me.

BigdummySteve wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 10:50 pm

redefined_cycles wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:31 pm This is rather saddening. I think I have about £200 or more invested in the various OS maps on there (both 1 in 25 and 1 in 50). Another load of money down the drain. Happened before for some reason with the official OS map which won't allow me to see the areas I'd bought cos (maybe) I'd not used em in so long...

oh well...

I feel your pain, I’d bought several hundred pounds worth of OS map tiles with the original OS app, the terms gave me access in perpetuity apparently. Not much use when they didn’t update the app and it just crashed on launch. They didn’t even carry over your tiles to the new platform, utter bastards.
Thankfully with ViewRanger I’ve stuck to a subscription fearing, rightly getting shafted again.
It really makes me angry that I actually pay for a product rather than stealing it via the internet get treated like sub standard. If I buy a book on Amazon I own it forever. Quite why OS are able to get away with it is beyond me.

That's right Steve. Technically with this (I would assume) it's OS maps that are shafting us again. As (again, assumed) the payment we made for the OS part of the Viewranger must have been going largely to them. Only assuming this cos thw rest of the mapping on Viewranger seem to be free.

Always thought it to be a good investment in keeping on upgeading my maps and buying more. Feels really sad and if anyone can figure out a way of me keeping all my OS data... I'm all ears..

Arse! I too paid outright for OS maps of all the good bits of the UK

https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/hill_ ... nce-729203

Last post on that thread sums it up. I just spent another £12 about 3 weeks ago too. Think I have at least 2/3 of England and about half of Wales in my Viewranger.. Oh well, at least we know now not to spend any more. Pity OS is so good or else could've moved over to some other platforms/mapping sheets...

Memory-Map is good for me so far, and the whole of the UK at 1:50k cost me £38 or so.
Will work on up to 5 devices as well

There must be a law somewhere which pertains to this? How can you sell something then, because it’s in the digital domain, removed it then ask you to pay for the same thing again? Just imagine if Waterstones knocked on your door, grabbed all yer maps, then asked you to pay for them again.

redefined_cycles wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:36 pm https://www.ukclimbing.com/forums/hill_ ... nce-729203

Last post on that thread sums it up. I just spent another £12 about 3 weeks ago too. Think I have at least 2/3 of England and about half of Wales in my Viewranger.. Oh well, at least we know now not to spend any more. Pity OS is so good or else could've moved over to some other platforms/mapping sheets...

Cut your losses. Back country Navigator has all of the UK OS maps at 1:25 and 1:50k that can be downloaded locally and it costs about £20 as a one off. It does work a bit of a fiddle using Bingmaps cache as it's source but when the OS and their partners treat paying customers so shabbily I'm less inclined to feel sorry for them. If you have an iPhone the developers call it BCN XE. It also covers overseas and OSM mapping, if one day we can go and travel abroad again...

There is a way of getting the entire OS GB map free at 1:50 and 1:25k from OS themselves using their new data hub api. I have built a proof of concept route planner using it. I can display OS and OSM maps within it. I need a few more months to release it but in the meantime if you can use QGIS then sign up for a data hub account with OS, get an API key and you can view their leisure maps as a wmts layer for free. QGIS let’s you plot routes etc... if you know how to use it. But it is not very easy to use hence my project.

I started to "trial" the new app on a few local walks, it's a bit clunky crashing once and not recording on another walk.

Not too impressed myself, luckily I only pay the annual subscription so will wait and see before I cancel.

Sorry to hear that Shaf. I don't think I'd invested that much - the subscription model probably saved me money when it came in - but can't be far off

barney wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:16 am I started to "trial" the new app on a few local walks, it's a bit clunky crashing once and not recording on another walk.

Not too impressed myself, luckily I only pay the annual subscription so will wait and see before I cancel.

One of the great things I found about VR was the reliability. In all the years I've used it I've only once lost a track, and that was probably a hardware fault. It seemed to cope with everything, up to and including a completely dead battery (it didn't continue recording, obviously, but saved the track before it lost power and recovered it). Way more reliable than these Garmin devices everyone seems to have.

I can't decide whether to cancel my subscription (due for renewal on Sunday) or pay for another year in the hope that I'll at least get another year of access.

BigdummySteve wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 11:52 pm There must be a law somewhere which pertains to this? How can you sell something then, because it’s in the digital domain, removed it then ask you to pay for the same thing again? Just imagine if Waterstones knocked on your door, grabbed all yer maps, then asked you to pay for them again.

Sadly, it's probably in the small print. They're probably not going to remove it, and in theory if you have a device with the current version of the app and the maps you have on it, it will stay that way indefinitely. It's not a good way to treat people though. They need to revisit rule 1.

htrider wrote: ↑Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:28 pm I never got on with viewranger as the desktop app was pish.

That's true. It's mainly about the app for me and I often used BikeHike or similar to plot routes and imported them, which as easy enough.

I'd forgotten about BackCountry Navigator. That seems like VR's long lost brother, separated at birth, from the way it gets recommended almost as inevitably as VR when the subject comes up. I thought Memory Map had got lost to the mists of time, but will check it out too.

thenorthwind wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 9:50 am Way more reliable than these Garmin devices everyone seems to have.

I can't comment on everyone else's devices but my Dakota/Oregons have been rock solid. I've not had any sort of device failure in 9 years or more.

Anquet pulled a similar stunt a few years ago. About a year after I'd shelled out for a download of Scotland and Northern England OS mapping (circa £175) they emailed to say they were moving to a subscription model and the old navigator app would no longer be supported. After (apparently) howls of protest they agreed to continue basic support for a few more years. Mine crashed and I couldn't get it to update. Repeated emails to Anquet went unanswered so I ended up ditching everything....

Before we get all misty eyed (and looking at the other thread on mapping) I recall a bikepacking trip I did in 2010 across the Mounth roads. I was using paper maps and needed 6 which weighed about a kilo and took a lot of space up. They were handy for extra insulation on the first night out though...

What a crap way to treat customers, but i'm not surprised. Consumer rights seem to barely register in the digital world, and not enforceable. I use the £25 premium subscription so I can get OS maps wherever I am, and I don't often use it to make tracks or save routes. Looking at it just now I don't think there's a difference for me, but pretty awful for those who have bought map tiles if it does mean these have gone.

Also, i've not seen any kind of notification or communication - which again is pretty terrible

htrider wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 11:28 am Before we get all misty eyed (and looking at the other thread on mapping) I recall a bikepacking trip I did in 2010 across the Mounth roads. I was using paper maps and needed 6 which weighed about a kilo and took a lot of space up. They were handy for extra insulation on the first night out though...

I remember reading about a chap and his uni mate who went on a multi-day trip in Scotland in I guess the 60's using old paper maps, after all the mountains don't change. On the last day, just about out of food but only a few hours walk from the finish they crested a ridge to see a loch that wasn't on the map It turns out a hydro scheme had somewhat changed the landscape so they spent an extra (hungry) night out due to the distance to walk round it

Digital mapping is a constant pain though, My favorite was Tracklogs but they are no longer trading, I had the whole country at 1:50k in Anquet but that is not downloadable on my new PC due to how old it is Perhaps subscription is the best way now?

Although currently I don't actually need any maps as I know every footpath/bridleway on the Island and I'm not allowed to go anywhere else

I can't comment on everyone else's devices

My garmin broke on the commute - just went off and would not switch on again
etrex 20 perhaps three years old with pretty minimal use

@sean_iow Although currently I don't actually need any maps as I know every footpath/bridleway on the Island and I'm not allowed to go anywhere else

Ditto for my local patch too!

sean_iow wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:05 pm I remember reading about a chap and his uni mate who went on a multi-day trip in Scotland in I guess the 60's using old paper maps, after all the mountains don't change. On the last day, just about out of food but only a few hours walk from the finish they crested a ridge to see a loch that wasn't on the map It turns out a hydro scheme had somewhat changed the landscape so they spent an extra (hungry) night out due to the distance to walk round it

That's from 'The last Hillwalker' by John Burns - he's talking about Loch Loyne just west of the A87 Kyle of Loch Alsh road.
I know someone who has made it across the old road when the loch level was low. Lots of photos on Geograph...

Yes. You do.


North Bridge by Colin Cadden - Flickr2BBcode


PICT3465 by Colin Cadden - Flickr2BBcode

htrider wrote: ↑Fri Jan 15, 2021 1:59 pm That's from 'The last Hillwalker' by John Burns

That's it I might did it out and read it again as it's been a while since I last read it.