I see there a feature over on bikepacking.com about winter all useful and interesting stuff but FFS, did we need this image?

I've just watched the video and I didn't spot that image, but he does talk about having a fire, although he also mentions the LNT principle at the end of the video.

Edit, just checked and that is the image on the video before it starts playing, I must have started it before I noticed.

I've just watched the video and I didn't spot that image, but he does talk about having a fire, although he also mentions the LNT principle at the end of the video.

... and what a mixed message that is but that image is the headline and perhaps the thing people will be drawn to most - clickbait really.

Bearbonesnorm wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 9:40 am ... and what a mixed message that is but that image is the headline and perhaps the thing people will be drawn to most - clickbait really.

I agree, but wasted on me as I didn't even notice, and I usually spot a fire a mile off in any video and start ranting to myself.

I didn't even notice

Can I ask what your eye was drawn to Sean, if not the big fire in the middle and fore of the shot?

But they've made the effort to carry that log on their front roll (headline photo), so gotta burn it right!?

I got to the page from a FB post and I was viewing on my phone, I was scrolling down to the video and clicking play at the same time as making a brew, it appears multitasking is getting harder with age But looking at it now I find it hard to believe I didn't notice it.

The picture also seems an odd choice as it's clearly not the same winter as Neil has, where's the snow? I also don't remember that scene so it's not a frame from the video? I wonder if that image was chosen, as you said, as 'click-bait'

I get why people want fires, but I’d be too worried about putting holes in my tarp/tent/jacket- maybe this isn’t a problem in real life though.

Just rest assured that in a few years bikepacking will be old hat and there’ll be a new thing out there.....

slarge wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:24 am holes.... tent...

Yeah that was my 2nd reaction. What chance that tent so close... karma Stu....

Photoshop innit?

Photoshop innit?

Either way, I'm not sure that makes any difference.

We should ask Neil what he thinks about that image, I'm sure he's a member here? Someone should PM him.

That 200mm fork seems rather overkill for the Ridgeway as well. Strange set-up all round TBH.

pistonbroke wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 10:38 am Photoshop innit?

Or possibly - like those beach Covid pics earlier in the year - a telephoto shot where the fire is much closer to the camera than the tent.

The image is just a cover shot, and happens not once in the video! Does it really matter that a headline photo has a fire in it?

Or are flames not the look we want?

Have a search and a read back through the forum as it's been discussed quite a bit previously.

To summarise (possibly badly) fires aren't LNT and many / several / some think they are best avoided. Consequently, including them in marketing or press just seems a bit naff and possibly sends the *wrong* message and/or encourages the *wrong* behaviour.

Cheeky Monkey wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:34 pm Have a search and a read back through the forum as it's been discussed quite a bit previously.

To summarise (possibly badly) fires aren't LNT and many / several / some think they are best avoided. Consequently, including them in marketing or press just seems a bit naff and possibly sends the *wrong* message and/or encourages the *wrong* behaviour.

But people like fire, it's part of that return to basics/outdoorsy experience.

Flames surely aren't all bad in the world of bikepacking?

But people like fire

Some people like abusing kids, others like injecting heroin between their toes.

Flames surely aren't all bad in the world of bikepacking?

If people want flames, buy a wood stove.

Have a search and a read back through the forum as it's been discussed quite a bit previously.

I can't be bothered to re-hash everyone's points

Cheddar Man wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:39 pm Flames surely aren't all bad in the world of bikepacking?

This is the damage caused by a fire, this was an organised bikepacking event.



This is it 11 months later



This is in an AONB and SSSI and at a view point just for good measure. I emailed the organiser to make them aware of this, they were going to get it sorrted, clearly that's a slow process. Any fire directly on the ground causes long term damage.

Cheddar Man wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:39 pm But people like fire, it's part of that return to basics/outdoorsy experience.

Which is why I've recently bought this for tomorrows Winter Bivi

50 fire pits on one night in July.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc. ... n-53664374

I think all those who market their outdoor products or ideas with such imagery should accept that they contribute to people lighting fires. For example, Alpkit have admitted exactly this.

But people like fire, it's part of that return to basics/outdoorsy experience.

- is the general default thought, yes. But once they understand the damage it does if not managed properly, or how much effort is involved in managing it properly, they tend not to bother or chose the site based on actual suitability of having a fire there (a managed camp ground etc). (edit, or they carry on regardless)

The image on BP.com etc is a problem as it's there out front saying "see, it's normal" and many won't read as far as the LNT disclaimer. And it may be normal in one part of the world (dunno) but internet's got wide reach.

As Cheeky Monkey says it's been done on here so there's some good points in past posts. I just say this as (tbh) a fan of a campfire during my younger days but a greater fan now of real LNT ethics.

sean_iow wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:55 pm

Cheddar Man wrote: ↑Fri Dec 18, 2020 12:39 pm But people like fire, it's part of that return to basics/outdoorsy experience.

Which is why I've recently bought this for tomorrows Winter Bivi

Forgive me if I’m stating the bleeding obvious Sean.
Make sure to place the fire box on stone or mud. I love using mine but they get mighty hot and can scorch the ground pretty badly if used without care.

But done appropriately, under control and safely, a little bit of fire and flame can really add to the evening and experience of being out and about.