Thanks Bob. I suspect (but probably wrong) all the talk by Bikepacking.com saying it's a reasonable difficulty route(s) and lots of folks turning up in gravel bikes, may have caused Stu to push the boundaries to what's acceptable (to you lot).

One of the fast riders was running fine/file tread tires probably on a gravel bike so that's not working. Also they would have had a very light setup as they wouldn't be planning to stop whereas for lots of us that was a real possibility

A key difference in the experience is a lot of faster riders would have been hitting the worst section in daylight which would have made a big difference as lines would have been a lot more obvious and water easier to cross.

I'd be surprised if anyone who did it in the dark got a black badge

I did get told a few packed before it as the second part of the East -West bogathon did for them (it would have been dark for them)

riderdown wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:32 am

Thanks Bob. I suspect (but probably wrong) all the talk by Bikepacking.com saying it's a reasonable difficulty route(s) and lots of folks turning up in gravel bikes, may have caused Stu to push the boundaries to what's acceptable (to you lot).

One of the fast riders was running fine/file tread tires probably on a gravel bike so that's not working. Also they would have had a very light setup as they wouldn't be planning to stop whereas for lots of us that was a real possibility

A key difference in the experience is a lot of faster riders would have been hitting the worst section in daylight which would have made a big difference as lines would have been a lot more obvious and water easier to cross.

I'd be surprised if anyone who did it in the dark got a black badge

I did get told a few packed before it as the second part of the East -West bogathon did for them (it would have been dark for them)

Another point that Stu made was that if you came to gravel bikes from an MTB background you'd likely have less problems than if from a road background (his way of saying those who had followed the bike industry's "next big thing" would struggle).

I hit the westernmost point of the route at 1720 so darkness fell halfway along the wet track. Other than a slight sense of humour failure (surprised that I had any to lose by that point) on the second moorland crossing it was really a case of just pressing on. Mind you, apart from couple of short road sections and the final off-road bit, maybe 5km in total, I'd done all of the route from then on multiple times so knew what was coming and mentally that makes a huge difference.

riderdown wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 9:32 am A key difference in the experience is a lot of faster riders would have been hitting the worst section in daylight which would have made a big difference as lines would have been a lot more obvious and water easier to cross.

Trust me, it didn't help in the slightest. I had zero idea where I was supposed to be on two tussock sections, despite doing it in perfect light.

I also checked, and I've gone faster in one of those sections at night (I assume because I couldn't see how vast and overwhelming it was).

Edit - It is generally best to get as much done in the daylight though. One thing that's far less likely to happen is missing gates and then cycling all the way across the edge of a field thinking you're on the path... ffs.

Richard G wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:11 am
I was racing a Landrover and also had a bunch of motorbikes coming the other way at points. No such luck with the clearness for me.

I think I met that landrover - it passed me on the road and then I passed it shortly after - I personally wouldn't take a (standard looking) series three through that lot! Was it you I passed on the bog hop? See below....

A wee tasty for next weekend!

PS - 11 hours sleep done, feeling slightly more human now.

If that's a pic of someone waving, it was me.

I used you as an example of someone that seemed to be able to cycle a lot of it, whereas I just kept losing half my wheel into holes.

Trust me, it didn't help in the slightest. I had zero idea where I was supposed to be on two tussock sections, despite doing it in perfect light.

Both and others ended up on the wrong side of the river a few times in the worst section of river/Landover track. Bogtrotting the moorland was simple in comparison

How are peoples perception (of difficulty) over previous editions, i was looking back over my times, and either it was easier, or im getting faster with experience / age?
My gut tells me that this edition was the hardest out of the ones below, but i have blocked the detail out of my mind!

2023 – 211km 5019m – 13h08 Moving / 13:54 Elapsed (Age-41)
2021 – 205km 5095m – 13h17Moving / 16h31 Elapsed (Age-39)
2020 – 183km 4303m – 11:12 Moving / 14:10 Elapsed – DNF – Broke bike (Age-38)
2019 – 213km 5630m – 15:41 Moving / 17:40 Elapsed (Age-37)

riderdown wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 10:51 am Both and others ended up on the wrong side of the river a few times in the worst section of river/Landover track. Bogtrotting the moorland was simple in comparison

Yeah, that's how I ended up nuts high in the water.

Alexinthepeaks wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 10:53 am My gut tells me that this edition was the hardest out of the ones below, but i have blocked the detail out of my mind!

It was the hardest we've had in a number of years, and you're clearly not human / aging backwards. lol

Alexinthepeaks wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 10:53 am How are peoples perception (of difficulty) over previous editions, i was looking back over my times, and either it was easier, or im getting faster with experience / age?
My gut tells me that this edition was the hardest out of the ones below, but i have blocked the detail out of my mind!

2023 – 211km 5019m – 13h08 Moving / 13:54 Elapsed (Age-41)
2021 – 205km 5095m – 13h17Moving / 16h31 Elapsed (Age-39)
2020 – 183km 4303m – 11:12 Moving / 14:10 Elapsed – DNF – Broke bike (Age-38)
2019 – 213km 5630m – 15:41 Moving / 17:40 Elapsed (Age-37)

I've done five:

2016 - 205km 4720m - 16:46 moving/ 19:01 elapsed (age - 57) far and away the easiest
2018 - 202km 4655m - 19:10 moving / 21:20 elapsed (age - 59) the first half was truly biblical rain and wind but if you pressed on then it cleared up around ten pm.
2020 - 205km 5500m - 21:07 moving / 22:48 elapsed (age - 61) This was the Covid edition so could start anytime within October and at any point on the loop, a genuine ITT with no-one else around.
2021 - Unsure as to data as my Garmin failed at the halfway point but got in about ten minutes under the 24hrs.
2022 - did the 300 version.
2023 - 205km 4800m - 22:50 moving / 30:51 elapsed (Age - 64) The big difference in moving/elapsed is due to a 7hr bivy I'm really surprised at the low moving time as I thought it would be over 24hrs.

This year's felt the hardest (by a long way) out of those.

fatbikephil wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 10:45 am

Richard G wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:11 am
I was racing a Landrover and also had a bunch of motorbikes coming the other way at points. No such luck with the clearness for me.

I think I met that landrover - it passed me on the road and then I passed it shortly after - I personally wouldn't take a (standard looking) series three through that lot! Was it you I passed on the bog hop? See below....

A wee tasty for next weekend!

PS - 11 hours sleep done, feeling slightly more human now.

Reminds me of 2014......
(Which I quite enjoyed, unlike many!)

slarge wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 11:30 am Reminds me of 2014......
(Which I quite enjoyed, unlike many!)

It's worth noting that for much of that section, the "path" was no-where near as clear as that (if it existed at all).

Edit - As for easiest ever, I'd say 2016 or 2017. It would actually be fascinating to see the median times (potentially even grouped into blocks), but I doubt the sheets still exist.

Someone could probably do it with a big enough friends list via Strava.

[/quote]

I'm really surprised at the low moving time as I thought it would be over 24hrs.

[/quote]

I think that may be a funcion of the GPS auto pause? I only properly stopped for 15 or 20min but i think the auto pause function estimated i had stoppped over the "slower sections".

Alexinthepeaks wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 11:46 am

I'm really surprised at the low moving time as I thought it would be over 24hrs.

[/quote]

I think that may be a funcion of the GPS auto pause? I only properly stopped for 15 or 20min but i think the auto pause function estimated i had stoppped over the "slower sections".
[/quote]

I was using a Garmin Oregon which doesn't have auto-pause, it just runs regardless until you actually press the pause icon on screen. The moving/overall times are from Strava so they'll have their own algorithm for determining "stopped" time but so long as each ping is different from the previous it seems to think you are moving.

Nice to meet you Richard (briefly) - I tend to try and ride everything, irrespective of whether it's quicker - possibly due to singlespeeding so wanting to avoid pushing if possible...
2021 was fairly straightforward (I equaled Alex's time!) but as a newby the climbing was a bit of an eye opener.
2022 - I thought the 300 was pretty damn hard - 26hrs15 with no sleep.
This year made last year look OK...

Yeah, the 300 will always put the 200 into context.

That said, I was quite comfortable the year I did it (until I had bike issues), but I'll never be that fitness again.

Alexinthepeaks wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 11:46 am I think that may be a funcion of the GPS auto pause? I only properly stopped for 15 or 20min but i think the auto pause function estimated i had stoppped over the "slower sections".

There's little more soul crushing than being told you've paused by your GPS when you're actually going as fast as you can.

I'll never understood why people don't turn that stuff off.

Also, all that fucking beeping. SHUT UP. Wouldn't be so bad, but the "off course" notifications most GPSs give start when it thinks you're about a centimetre to the right or left of the actual trail.

Richard G wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:29 pm I'll never understood why people don't turn that stuff off.

Also, all that fucking beeping. SHUT UP. Wouldn't be so bad, but the "off course" notifications most GPSs give start when it thinks you're about a centimetre to the right or left of the actual trail.

You do realise you can turn the beeps and off course notifications off!

Alexinthepeaks wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:36 pm

Richard G wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:29 pm I'll never understood why people don't turn that stuff off.

Also, all that fucking beeping. SHUT UP. Wouldn't be so bad, but the "off course" notifications most GPSs give start when it thinks you're about a centimetre to the right or left of the actual trail.

You do realise you can turn the beeps and off course notifications off!

I think you pushed too hard on the ride... that was literally what I wrote in my post suggesting people do.

Alexinthepeaks wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:36 pm

Richard G wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 12:29 pm I'll never understood why people don't turn that stuff off.

Also, all that fucking beeping. SHUT UP. Wouldn't be so bad, but the "off course" notifications most GPSs give start when it thinks you're about a centimetre to the right or left of the actual trail.

You do realise you can turn the beeps and off course notifications off!

You can turn that sub standard off...!?! I like it during the day, but at night it's so loud and annoying...

riderdown wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:09 am

Will I ever get a black badge?

You would have last year if you hadn't bedded down in a bus shelter

I was tired. Much less training last year too!

Escape Goat wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 2:40 pm

riderdown wrote: ↑Mon Oct 09, 2023 8:09 am

Will I ever get a black badge?

You would have last year if you hadn't bedded down in a bus shelter

I was tired. Much less training last year too!

I blame that second sticky toffee pudding with artificial whipped cream I mean, you did get "the eye" from Pauline.

I always do! I’m always in trouble with her.

My legs are surprisingly stiff / swollen today. Unusual.

Might have to go for a recovery ride.

Unless something changes next weekend, this years award for 'cutting it fine' will go to Alpkit Kenny who set off on the 300 at 07.35 on Sat and returned at 19.33 on Sun.

Surprisingly, I recall last time, he returned with even less margin.