traditional touring cooking (2 people)

[Trail-rat]

After melting my frying pan last weekend with my whisperlite - a moment of in-attention while trying to keep a mate spinning at the strathpuffer - and cook my dinner.....

i need to buy a new pan set - looking at the alpkit ti set - fair enough thats the easy part....

my issue is - having been introduced to the simplicity of meth stoves by here--- i have an 8g stove for solo trips for coffee brew duties. im tempted by a trangia/similar

Are bigger meths stoves as succeptable to low temperatures/cold meth and wind as the 8g stove ? the one thing i know about my whisperlite is it has never let me down and it burns practically anything ignitable and works well even in low temperatures - ive been all over the world with it - how ever its heavy , especially once you carry a spares kit for seals and moving parts in the pump etc , doesnt pack down partucularly well into a pan unless you have a deep pan and can be messy to fill

lastly anyone got any experiance with the bruler from alpkit as the rule in our house is - if it cant go in the dishwasher(alu pans) it will get ruined as it will end up in there by design or accident at 10pm on a sunday night when cleaning up from the weekends adventure...... so toying with the plain alpkit ti pan set and a bruler - already have a concertina heatshield as an alternative to the trangia.

thoughts ?

[Bearbonesnorm]

If you mean actual cooking rather than boiling water, then I'd say aluminium rather than Ti pots. They transfer heat much better and are far less likely to produce hot-spots.

Not tried a Bruler although both Taylor and me tried for a number of weeks to get an almost identical set-up (badged as Esbit) to boil water - I seem to recall that we both failed and gave up after numerous attempts.

Are bigger meths stoves as succeptable to low temperatures/cold meth and wind as the 8g stove ?

Generally yes. Keeping your stove / fuel warm often helps but the real deal breaker is the windshield. My experience of the small concertina windshields (badged Vargo) is that they restrict incoming air flow considerably.

[sean_iow]

If there's 2 of us I use an Evernew ultralight titanium burner, http://www.backpackinglight.co.uk/cooke ... RB102.html, and trivet, http://www.backpackinglight.co.uk/cooki ... RE104.html and along with an Alpkit MiTi mug (older 750m ml version) this will boil enough water for 2 of us to have tea or rehydrate a meal.



I have a tupperware style pot which is an exact fit in the MiTi mug and inside this I can then fit a MSR titanium mug with the burner etc. inside. The whole package fits into a stem cell. The wife has a similar plastic pot with her mug inside and some odds and ends, plus 2 pot covers I've made and that all fits into a stem cell on her bike. It seems like a lot of kit compared to when I just have one of Stu's 8g stoves and a mug but when when there is 2 of us we like some more luxury. We can boil water and make a bru and then drink that whilst the water boils to make dinner, usually the classic supernoodles with a cupa soup for flavour made by just adding water in the tupperwate with the pot cosy.

Of course we're not actually cooking over the stove. When I used a trangia (30 years ago in the scouts) the problem was controlling the heat so as not to weld the dinner to the pan. Even with the simmer ring in place (which they've now improved so it may be better) the heat output was sometimes too much.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Sean, if you find you need to reduce the output of the Evernew, ditch the trivet and stand the pot directly on the stove

[sean_iow]

I previously used it directly on the stove when I first got it but then bought the trivet as it's faster and I only use it to boil water, but I think it might be more fuel efficient with the pot directly on top? I might be imagining this as I've not done back to back tests. Looking at my picture the one thing I do need to address is that excuse for a wind-shield I'll have to make a new one, perhaps a scaled up version of the template that comes with the 8g stove would work?

[Bearbonesnorm]

but I think it might be more fuel efficient with the pot directly on top?

It should be as you're only producing about half the output.

I'll have to make a new one, perhaps a scaled up version of the template that comes with the 8g stove would work?

Yeah, it might take a little playing about with but it should work fine. Just remember that air volume within the shield is important, so a nice wide base would be a good starting point ... like this.

[benp1]

The ultimate meths cooking set is a Trangia

I think mine is a 25. It's a bit battered and is the plain ally one with a kettle, but it's so reliable. Haven't used it in a while but there's nothing to break so I'd be happy taking it on a trip without checking it first. It's heavy all in though so I've only used it on car camping trips.

Not as powerful as gas but I've done fry ups, stir frys, casseroles etc on it fine. Packs up quite small considering the size of the pots

[Trail-rat]

to be clear im looking to cook food for us for a couple of weeks on the road so boiling water alone and rehydrating stuff isnt going to cut it - im all set up for boiling water imo.... even with 2 of us on an over nighter or a couple of days id just take the 400ml mugs and an 8g stove + windshield.

im thinking a bit more flexible than just boiling water as we tend to be touring through towns and carrying more gear - quick currys / stews hell ive even done risotto on the whisperlite - that took some effort but it was tasty - basically alternating the fuel supply somewhere between off and the absolute lowest setting to get a light simmer going.

our previous kit was copper bottomed stainless steel quite weighty so i replaced with an alu set a few years back .... and the lid/pan is now melted - which is a bummer

i bit more research says i probably want bigger pots than the alpkit style stuff .... which makes the trangia deal a winner bar the fact its alu for me :(

[jameso]

lastly anyone got any experiance with the bruler from alpkit

Same product but from somewhere else I think, Andy brought it along last summer. That and a BB meths burner meant we had lardons or sausages in chilli tomato sauce or pesto with pasta for dinner and omelettes for breakfast - cracked-open eggs carried up there in a spare water bottle. Cooked with the mugs and a pan with a lid. The Bruler/Trangia type is a bit bulkier than I'd have considered but the simmer ring and ability to re-seal with meths still in is good for doing more than simple boiled-water meals. Great for more relaxed trips. I have an MSR but have only used it further afield where fuel is a lottery, if meths is available I'd use this set up, way less faff and bulk.

[benp1]

For that sort of cooking, a meths stove with a remote feed might work, or an adjustable one. I know Stuart does both

My only real 'cooking' experience on meths is with a trangia, all my other meths stoves are water boilers essentially

The bigger the cooking pot the easier it'll be to cook in it, and big pots don't collapse down. A frying pan is pretty useful, but a big enough pot set means you can use a lid properly

I have a mate who does bacon in the lid of one of the Primus hard anodised ally sets, done steaks in it too. I'd prefer to use a bigger lid for cooking, something like a Snow Peak 1400. Evernew do a set like this too (I had a non stick 1400 version but sold it on)

[whitestone]

If you have a look around the (many) sites about soda/beer/pop can stoves then a few mention simmering rings. Not tried one myself but it might be worth a try.

[Bearbonesnorm]

If you have a look around the (many) sites about soda/beer/pop can stoves then a few mention simmering rings. Not tried one myself but it might be worth a try.

AfterBurner does the simmery thing.

[Chew]

... and the lid/pan is now melted

How did you manage to melt aluminium?

[Zippy]

... and the lid/pan is now melted

How did you manage to melt aluminium?

With Fire!!! or any other significant heat source, but most likely this will be from FIRE!!!

Quick bit of googling reveals that the melting point of aluminium is 660deg C (can't comment on what alloy the pan would be, so obviously this information isn't quite correct), and the temperature of the flame from a meths fuel source is in the region of 1100 deg C, so it would be possible given the right conditions.

[Trail-rat]

have you used a whisperlite..... its a bit like the stove equivalent of my mapp torch i use for light soldering.....

the whole stove gloves red hot when you get her going - and thats steel....

the pan being much thinner stood no chance when left on the stove and the cooking oil , fat and water from the meat had burnt off....

Ive gone full circle and im back at either the MSR alpine or the MSR base. Heavier than the others ive looked at but useful sizes - thicker material and from friends experiances - much more robust. Not all that much more expensive once i get the mrs to buy them "for" her DOE group...... im never going to use them for bike packing - i just use the 8g stove and my ti mug - 400ml mug means you need to do 2 portions to eat all your supernoodles :D

[sean_iow]

I've got a set of MSR alpine pans and have been impressed, they are a quality item. I use mine on a Primus OmniFuel which is also capable of some serous output and the pans have been fine. As a test I once boiled a pan of water on my kitchen cooker (gas) and then again on the OmniFuel and it was less than half the time, which should give an idea of the output for anyone who's not used a multifuel stove. To be fair to the makers of my kitchen cooker it's not designed to have the required output to melt snow at altitude, there is no mains gas on the mountains I've also got a heat exchanger which goes around the outside of the pan and speeds up boil time/reduces fuel consumption which is worth investing in if going anywhere cold.

[Joshvegas]

How about a honey stove.

Burn whatever you find and have a trangia burner as back up.

Also allows you to add barbeque to your repertoir.

[jameso]

Burn whatever you find

Sounds like my general approach to cooking

[deft punk]

AfterBurner does the simmery thing.

It does & very well too. Hasn't quite replaced the Trangia as my favourite cookset, but it's a surprisingly close second and obviously beats it in the size & weight stakes

Pair it with [one of those alpkit mugs with the funny names] for least bulk or pair it with a wee aluminium pot for cooking for >1 person & less weight, which surprised me considering how much love titanium kit gets

[whitestone]

Not so much the weight of titanium as the fact that it won't react with foodstuffs unlike aluminium. It's also non-toxic.

Aluminium has a density of 2.8g/cc (depends on the specific alloy) whereas titanium is 4.5g/cc, i.e. about 60% denser, but you've also got to take into account other properties of the materials so for a given object (say a cooking pot) you might not need as much volume of titanium and therefore weight to get the same end result. For example, aluminium is about a third as dense as steel but an aluminium bike frame isn't a third the weight of a steel frame as you need more material to account for weaknesses in the alloy.

[adjustablewench]

Over the years I have done loads of cooking on trangias, I have the large one and can happily cook for 4.

It's the same as any cooking, once you get used to controlling the heat - which with a trangia simmer ring is a bit of an art but it does work, you can cook most things.

When I want to cook more but don't want to carry all of the trangia I have used a burner stand with the small pans or with a set of ti pans I have. You then have to take something as a windshield but it's still less bulky that the whole trangia

The stand I use is like this http://www.goarmy.co.uk/steel-meths-bur ... wwodOt0IzQ

Then you can use all sorts of pans not just the trangia ones.

[Trail-rat]

well i went shopping in town yesterday ..... and failed miserably. Craigdon had a couple of dusty sets of pans that looked like they arrived on the arc. The big tiso had the full trangia range and an msr quick 2 and alpine 2 and the same in the cotswolds shop.

Ive decided upon looking at various things and for reasons mentioned above - im gonna go with the msr alpine stainless.... but the 3 pot set up not the 2 pot.... 1 lid for 2 pots is about as much use as a chocolate teapot when your cooking a proper meal on a single burner and not to mention inefficient - ie normally id bring the carbs to the boil - then put them to one side with the lid on - then cook the meat or what ever in the pan - also with the lid on for the most part.... the lids also double as plates for civalised cooking - i can chuck them in the dishwasher.

Dont have to take all 3 pans with me but we regularly tour as a group with other folks so the ability to take a big pan and cook for the group rather than everyone doing their own thing is a bonus.

[RobMac]

Kind of a related question, does anybody else find cooking with meth's quite therapeutic?
The silence, the smell the slow flickering flame

NO! Me neither

[adjustablewench]

ie normally id bring the carbs to the boil - then put them to one side with the lid on - then cook the meat or what ever in the pan - also with the lid on for the most part..

For this sort of thing with the trangia I have the pot that I'm cooking with the lid on then place the one that's hot that needs to be warm on the lid (works as long as everythig is level and stable!) with one of our eating plates as a lid

If I have a fire going as well you can carefully balance pans on rocks so the cook or stay warm.

Aluminium heats up much quicker the steel so more fuel efficient too

[Trail-rat]

whats the melting point of orikaso ?