BCM / Bryan Chapman route

[jameso]

Qs about the main roads used on this route. I know it overlaps with the TINAT600 that I rode and enjoyed in 2018 but the BCM does have a fair few miles on A roads, the A40 and A470 out of Abergavenny in the first 65km or so, the A470 again N of Builth Wells up to Llangurig, back on the A470 south past Trawsfynydd, and so on. That may have been ok back then and the roads will be quieter if you start early, Trawsfynydd is 350km in so ~24hrs after starting and early am again. But the last time I was on the A470 a bit further north at the end of the TINAT around early afternoon I swore I'd never ride on it again. I've ridden other A-roads in Wales that have been quiet and pleasant riding though.

The BCM appeals as a classic audax route that I want to do as a solo ride or maybe the event itself. I need something to aim for at the moment and Chepstow is a 2.5hr ride from here so it could be a ride from the front door. Riding on A-roads when I'm tired isn't my idea of fun though so I'm wary.

Anyone had recent experience of it?

[Johnallan]

I rode the Audax event last year and don't recall any issues with traffic on the route. One of my favourite events

[jameso]

Thanks John. Maybe not traffic issues I'm thinking of, just being on busy main roads where a car is overtaking every 10 seconds.

[redefined_cycles]

Not got exp of the BC route James. But when I did the Rapha500 using this https://www.audax.uk/event-details/1265 ... 500_pint_2 route in Dec. I tried to edit out some of the loop to make it more accommodating to stay away from some big roads on way back.

But my partner (hardened Audaxer with plenty badges under his belt) seemed to want to do the original full route (kindof and no offence to him). Them A roads on the way back though were mental. 2 Lane dual carriageway and fast. We were riding it in the dark/midnight so not too bad, but it still wound him up about my speed/pace (I was having some lighting issues).

Based on that A road exp I decided then that in future I'll continue to edit out any major roads from the official addax loops I attempt. Not worth the stress IMO and definitely not my idea of a fun ride.

Not sure if that helps but I gues what I'm trying to say is, yes edit it if you can (and I can use your gpx file heehee). Hardened audaxers are purists IMO so won't be willing to change certain lanes if they can help it. Could be wrong and yes, I know it's slightly less simple than what I've made it out.

[redefined_cycles]

No offence to John or any other addax regulars. They're a different kettle of fish (insert smile face here).

[Dyffers]

My palmares: I've ridden what I would describe as the 'classic' Chapman 600 5 or 6 times between 2007 and 2016 when Mark Rigby was running it, done Richie Tout's alternative finish (retracing the the first 100k for the last 100k, dull) in 2019 and done Mark Rigby's more recent 600 from Tewkesbury in 2022 and 2023 which folows a lot of the classic Chapman route.

TL:DR I never had a problem, and mostly the busy A roads are done at early or later times making them fine.

In more detail:
The early main roads around Abergavenny are fine because you start at 6am on Saturday. The A479 climb over to Talgarth isn't usually busy at that time. The minor road on the other side of the Wye is lovely and quiet and keeps you off the A470 to Builth.
The A470 to Rhayader and on to Llandildoes is quite busy but has been widened about ten years ago, but you can cross over to the lane on the other side of the Wye to Llanurig which has no traffic at all. The reservoir road and mountain pass to Mach is pretty quiet.
The climb past Corris can be busy but I've never been close-passed, then you do 40mph down to Dolgellau from there, no issues with traffic.
The coast route from Harlech is quiet, and over the pass to Llanberis I've always done early evening so traffic is getting quiet; you can catch cars on the decent.
The route back to Beddgelert is quiet and the A470 past Trawsfynnydd is typically done in the dark wishing for Dolgellau to come sooner but generally almost traffic-less.
I can see how the A470 from Dolgellau to Newtown could be pretty unpleasant at the wrong tie of day but it's always been a nice quiet run on Sunday morning, reaching Newtown by about 10am.
The busiest part might be the A483 climb out of Newtown, done about midday. There is a (shorter, steeper) lane that runs parallel to the east that comes out at the Dolfor turn off the A road that used to be on the 'scenic' official route that is a viable alternative.
The 'classic' route from my day left the A road at Dolfor, went over to Knighton, then Weobley (traditionally ice creams on the village green outside the shop), Monmouth and up the Tintern valley.
Only the A466 rollers (including the Llancloudy climb that everyone used to dread at 550km urgh) and the Tintern valley road were busy, Tintern especially with tourists if it was a sunny Sunday afternoon.

Lots of happy memories of weekends spent riding with mates round this route, eating ice creams in the rain and listening to ChrisN's knees creaking riding fixed as he always used to. One of my favourites, and the 600 I've done way more than any other.

If you haven't got the classic route I can send a gpx.

Paul

[Dyffers]

Shaf

I haven't done it but I think the 500 in a one-er route goes East-west from Bristol sort of along the M4 corridor, correct? If so, the A roads in mid and north Wales are a very different experience to the middle of England.

[redefined_cycles]

Shaf

I haven't done it but I think the 500 in a one-er route goes East-west from Bristol sort of along the M4 corridor, correct? If so, the A roads in mid and north Wales are a very different experience to the middle of England.

Good to know about the BC. I suppose we can't have everything when it's a winter loop. If you go for ice-free type routes (bus routes get first priority when being deiced etc) then you'd probably get a few big/busy roads at least. If you go for quieter lanes then the chances of ice/snow are gonna be heightened!?

This is the loop we did for Dec. On the cards hopefully for this coming Dec too (for some sort of charity project obviously) but I wonder how treacherous the Bryan Chapman would be for a winter loop!

[Dyffers]

https://youtu.be/R8GoL8UzIj0?si=UOOtu41UHs_bNyJG

I don't fancy descending Pen-y-Pass on 23s in the snow.

[whitestone]

https://youtu.be/R8GoL8UzIj0?si=UOOtu41UHs_bNyJG

I don't fancy descending Pen-y-Pass on 23s in the snow.

During the 1990s I lived in N. Wales and the loop of the Snowdon massif was one of my regular rides. I usually rode it anticlockwise so the descent of Llanberis Pass was near the end. One time I crested the top at Pen y Pass and headed downhill. Let's just say I was shifting - I was doing 46mph by the first bend! Anyway relatively easy to overtake the tourists as they'd be worried about the narrow road and on a bike it was easy to see over the low retaining wall on the RH side. I swung round a LH bend and there was a BMW pulling out of one of the parking bays that at the time were available. The driver looked uphill and either didn't see me or thought "bike, not going that fast" and continued to pull out. Slowly. I applied the brakes but as I was doing so I drifted over the central line and hit a cats eye. My back wheel began making intermittent contact with the road The driver realised that I was shifting and stopped. I shot past, screaming "Bastard!" into his open window and continued downhill. I managed to check my Cateye computer which was showing 42mph at that point. The BMW finally overtook me about three miles later somewhere between Nant Peris and Llanberis. I managed a glower at the rather sheepish driver

[redefined_cycles]

Phew. Well done at saving yourself there Bob - I'd be very thankful at that. 46mph and 42mph, nasty speeds them!! I once did that on the road descent down to Meltham from the top of Wessenden Head. I too recall looking at the Cateye comp and getting concerned as the bend was just coming up.

Saved myself. Wasn't winter and was on the mtb. Learnt my lesson from that...

Not on 23c tyres thankfully Dyffers, but will check out that link shortly. I think maybe the Cambridge Loop is probably the smarter choice. We ended up on the bus dedicated lane - the one where the side wheels of the bus lock into the sides of the curb - on the way back soon after Cambridge. This was due to floods in the cycle lane on the sides. Thankfully in the dead of night (first night) too so no buses coming other way. Otherwise we'd have been rather shafted!

[jameso]

That's great info, thanks Dyffers - appreciate the detail. A good few years ago I rode the LWL / old 4 Across route solo from home (lived in the Herts area then) and though riding within audax pace I made the mistake of setting off a little later than the event, and about 90 mins riding further out than the start. The return leg traffic around Henley and Marlow was grim as I hit that a few hours later than the event riders would have. So the importance of riding at the time and pace intended isn't lost on me.
If you have a classic or least-A road version of the route that would be great, can you post or PM a link? I hadn't realised it'd varied much over the years. Cheers.

[JackT]

As Dyffers says, there have been a number of different versions of the route over the years James, as organisers, conditions and tastes have changed.

Originally the out and back sections took in different parts of Wales in more of a loop, then for a few years it became a faster route with more A40 and A470. But careful timing meant riders did the busier road sections at quieter times. That’s often the case with the longer audax routes - organisers will put in a long A road section in the middle of the night or very early in the morning - helps ease the challenge of navigation (esp for the non-GPS equipped) and makes for easy fast miles in wide, smooth roads.

This year’s route (designed by the new organiser Will Pomeroy) is new iteration - and an improvement - in my opinion. It puts the return back further east on lumpier roads and back to the Wye Valley finale. The inclusion of the Gospel Pass at 500km+ may have been a surprise for people used to the A40 return. Will has put a lot of thought into evolving the event and as well as the 600 he offered a simultaneous 2x300 and 3x200 for riders who wanted more sleep time and quieter roads but still wanted to be part of the same (long) weeked. The 3x200 routes deliberately take in quieter but hiller alternatives so you might want to look at these as the basis of a road packing tour if that’s your plan, James.

[jameso]

Thanks Jack. I'd not realised the route had changed quite as often so I'll look up the new route and the 3x200s. Perhaps I should map out my own route based on those and roads I know already then ride the actual event one year. A-roads at night in a good group of riders are much more enjoyable than riding alone.