Pinion Gearbox???

[Catrike16]

Hi All,
I am considering a bike with a Pinion 12 speed box and Gates carbon belt for my bikepacking bike, anyone used a Pinion?
Any thoughts, experience, comments welcomed?
Or should I save the £1200 and get a normal 1x12 set up
cheers

[rudedog]

Depends on your own circumstances I guess.

What benefits do you think this will bring?

Can you justify the extra spend?

[GoneCaving]

I've been riding a pinion/gates hardtail for about 18months now and am very happy with it. So my 2c:

Pros:
* Low maintenance - annual oil change, and that's about it, the belt gets cleaned when I wash the bike
* No chance of striking or fouling the derailleur
* Huge range of gears, I'm running a C1.12 w 32/32, and running a wider range than a 30/10-52 (roughly equiv on the high end, and close to a 28/52 on the low end). Kinda handy with a loaded bike!

Cons:
* Price & bike, no going back once you have a pinion frame. I think the price is maybe less of a concern than it might first appear. In roughly the same length of time that I've had the pinion bike, I've replaced a chain, shifter and derailleur on my other hardtail, so maybe over time the difference isn't as much as you'd think.
* Weight - 1kg over an equivalent derailleur setup
* Belt - needs to be set up correctly in terms of alignment of sprocket, and handled with care when installing (no twisting, or bending it back on itself), and if it breaks, then you'd better have a spare! (which reminds me I need to order one!!!)
* Spares are going to be harder to come by in general
* Twist shifter - more or less limits you to flat bars (as far as I know the Cinq shifters are no longer available). I've found that I got used to the shifting very quickly, and it's great to be able to stop in a high gear, and shift to a low gear before you move off.

[Catrike16]

Thanks All,
My knees are minus half the meniscus, plus I can't be described as a snipers nightmare.
The extra gear range, lack of maintenance on the trail and removing potential chain and derailleur issues all appeal.
If it lasts as long as they claim cost over time probably evens out a little. Not concerned about 1kg weight penalty having just lost 4 stones and still going down.
Cheers All

[Itchynuts]

If I didn't need an eBike I would struggle to choose between the Rohloff hub and the Pinion gearbox but have a look here :-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_hx4V9mYuw

This guy travels the world by bike and so has a lot of experience with the Pinion (and the Rohloff) and belt drives

Some of his information is a bit dated now. e.g. he mentions a twist changer for the Rohloff and they have had an electric shifter for a while now. I don't know about Pinion.

[fatbikephil]

Good insight on that bikepacking.com...
https://bikepacking.com/gear/pinion-gearbox-review/

[Itchynuts]

I looked at the review at :-

https://bikepacking.com/gear/pinion-gearbox-review/

It seems very comprehensive and fair except for two things. I think the guy in the video mentioned the belt stretching or if he didn't use the word stretch he showed that he could rotate the crank a couple of degrees before the bike started to move.
I don't know if this was due to play in the gearbox or the rear hub or anything else but the belt does not stretch.

The other thing he said was the belt was noisy. I think the instuctions say something like pour some soapy water onto it if it squeaks when brand new but then it will stop and stay stopped. Most people with belt drives will mention how eerily quiet they are.

[voodoo_simon]

If you’re in the ‘gram, this chap has done quite a bit of touring on his pinion
https://instagram.com/tristanrid?igshid ... I4NDBkZg==

Rode a couple of times with a Swedish chap in Finland in the winter who had a pinion, he carried a spare belt with him on the bike. Not aware that he actually used it but maybe something to bare in mind

[Catrike16]

I think on balance I will probably opt for the pinion.

[Alexinthepeaks]

Has anyone seen the new Smartshift (electroncic) shifting system by Pinion: It looks fantastic, two of my main issues were having to stop pedelling to shift, and the grip shift. Both of these are now no longer an issue:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WCegy0YJRj8

Ive also seen that Olsen are looking to integrate this system going foreward - think i may be looking to explolre these options soon!

https://olsenbikes.co.uk/blogs/olsen-bl ... o-electric

[ledburner]

There's also Kindernay VIX A more modern take on a rohloff, stocked by https://ghyllside.co.uk/groupsets/8335- ... y-xii.html,
I looks promising. Bikepacking https://bikepacking.com/news/kindernay- ... gear-hubs/
also reviewed it. The swap out hub shell - rims looks interesting..

[Itchynuts]

The electronic shifting description is almost a word for word copy of the Rohloff text which is a shame but overall the combination of electronic shifting, wide gear range, belt drive and integrated motor sounds like a combination that will be hard to beat.

I can't find any details about the pedigree of the motor though. If it is not from a tried and tested manufacturer then I think I would wait a year or two to see how reliable it is long term.

That niggle aside it sounds like a world beater to me.

[GoneCaving]

Has anyone seen the new Smartshift (electroncic) shifting system by Pinion: It looks fantastic, two of my main issues were having to stop pedelling to shift, and the grip shift.

It sounds pretty neat. Other nice features include an autoshift to a user preset gear when you come to a stop. I’ve not seen any indication of price yet. Mucho dinero is my guess.

[Alexinthepeaks]

Apparentley around £400 up on the standard geared version so not crazy crazy....

[fatbikerbill]

Anyone know if the frame mounting of the smart.shift unit is the same as the 'old' ones?

[godivatrailrider]

I think it is. It'd be foolish to change the mounts on the gearbox just because you've added electric shifting.
Not many uk manufacturers though, only really found Travers & Olsen.

[psling]

Not many uk manufacturers though, only really found Travers & Olsen.

Aren't Alpkit offering a Pinion option now. I know it's not UK manufacturer but they are UK based although I doubt they can offer any sort of custom build.

[Bearlegged]

18 Bikes have certainly done Pinion frames in the past. I'm not sure how much they're doing custom work at the mo though, I think they're concentrating on their off-the-peg range.

[godivatrailrider]

Not many uk manufacturers though, only really found Travers & Olsen.

Aren't Alpkit offering a Pinion option now. I know it's not UK manufacturer but they are UK based although I doubt they can offer any sort of custom build.

Yes they do ... a few

[fatbikerbill]

Alpkit have offered pinion for quite a while I think on the broken road and signal.

I was pondering/dreaming it for a gravel/touring type bike.

[godivatrailrider]

Alpkit have offered pinion for quite a while I think on the broken road and signal.

I was pondering/dreaming it for a gravel/touring type bike.

Ditto. I'm 'owed' a bike since my Scandal was stolen in Northampton 4 years ago. I'm happy with the Singular Rooster, the Jones Spaceframe SS, & the Croix de Fer. They cover most eventualities.
So been pondering a Pinion Ti something. The Olsen's look ok and I've been speaking to Michael Travers.... but as I'm getting older, I'm not sure I need a 29er MTB so much.
If I'm buying a nice bit of kit , it might as well be a NICE bit of kit.
The pinion makes a lot of sense for bikepacking so having something that does that well and covers distance well too, possibly drop bar / monster cross / gravelish would be good.

[Lazarus]

I bump into some guys locally wgo have them and they have not had any issues in a number of years use ( broken roads with qr dropouts so quite old)
They do carry a spare belt when bikepacking though ( apparently you can change gear with an Allen key if cables break)but never had any issues.
Would want a test ride first as quite spendy but they claim no chains ever or mech repairs make them better value over the long run.
(.given gates carbon upgrade is circa £300 I am not that convinced by the argument)

[GoneCaving]

I'm riding a Travers Ti Pinion bike for the last two years. No issues with the Gates belt, though I heard from at least two people at the WRT this year who've broken belts, and I've since started to carry a spare on longer rides. I have worn the front sprocket considerably, but I suspect that's coz its a Al sprocket (I'm guessing Michael may have had trouble sourcing parts during Covid, and I'll switch it out for a steel version at some point). The belt is also squeaking a bit, solved some a bit of silicone lube or water, and I suspect that's related to the sprocket wear.

Yes, you can change gear with an Allen key, through you've got to flip open the cover protecting the gear cables to get access, you'd probably do it to find a suitable SS ratio to get you out of trouble).

The Smart Shift sounds like a nice way of smoothing out the shifting, but imho you get used to the shifting pretty quickly.

[fatbikerbill]

I was hoping that the smart shift might more easily open up the opportunity to using drop bars.

[fatbikerbill]

I can't find any details about the pedigree of the motor though. If it is not from a tried and tested manufacturer then I think I would wait a year or two to see how reliable it is long term.

That niggle aside it sounds like a world beater to me.

@itchynuts Are you referring to the motor for the e-bike version or whatever automates the gear change?