Ideal weight!!

[mountainbaker]

Same old stuff, same old people. How very tedious for you.

To be fair, you once told me you found the GDBMR boring. So I think that I should maybe take it as a compliment.

I'll shut up now and you can go back to reading the 200th "what bivvy?" Or "which Garmin" thread.

[Bearbonesnorm]

See I was right ... it is Grumpy Thursday.

[sean_iow]

As an example of the difference lower weight makes:-
My bikepacking bike is singlespeed and weighs 11kg as a bare bike and my usual gearing is 34/17 and I can ride up most hills where I live. Fully loaded recently it weighed 22kg and to be able to get up the same hills with the same sort of effort I lower the gearing to 32/20.

[Bearbonesnorm]

I'm wondering, can there actually be a definitive answer to the original question? Surely even on an individual basis, there's too many variables and unknowns?

[NorwayCalling]

I'm wondering, can there actually be a definitive answer to the original question? Surely even on an individual basis, there's too many variables and unknowns?

Yes... 5 kg

[Mariner]

So I loose 5kg then strap 5kg of gear on the bike and still have to walk.

[HaYWiRe]

Without sounding like a hippy, its easy to forget what mindset and emotions can do for your fitness.

Best diet in the world that makes you feel like crap will make you ride like crap. Again, feeling overweight can have the same affect.

Lose weight, gain confidence, feel good in your own skin and suddenly the suck,... sucks a little less.

I ride fueled by pork pies, croissants, muesli bars and whatever my favourite cafe puts in their baps that day. Now food, diet and nutrition is my life, im insulin dependant diabetic so my life literally depends on my knowing what im eating. But i ride for enjoyment and enjoy certain foods, that matters more than calorie to weight to power ratios.

Was is not Stu that wrote how a true bikepacker was the bloke riding a 100k audax on nothing but a tunnocks tea cake? (Or something like that?)


Me? My wattage and speed up my local hill is at its best when i wear my best jersey and have "f**k Diabetes" written on my bike! Its all in the mind!

[giryan]

I can definitely attest at the losing weight and gaining performance thing, not bikepacking, but analogously.
I'm doing a lot of kettlebell work, and training for a Strong First kettlebell instructor certification.
Earlier this year I was doing Turkish get-ups with a 24kg bell, and beginning to feel like I owned that movement, so progressed up to a 28kg bell, and obviously it's hard
But along side that time of adding 4kg to the lift I also lost 8kg of bodyweight, so really I'm lifting 4kg less off the ground!!
Now I wouldn't recommend putting a kettlebell in a bike and cycling with it at all, but I'm sure you can see where it's going

[mh24]

No idea or opinion on diet types etc, but

Real food, whole foods.

is a good point. Easy to drop weight by changing some common food types or cutting carbs, fasted riding etc.
Watts per kg overall is what makes you fast uphill. Power to weight ratio. My when riding and eating normally is ~75kg and I find dropping 3-4kg makes quite a difference to my climbing on hills I know well. If i drop below a certain weight my power and (it seems) my recovery drop, but down to 70-71kg it's fine. I guess it depends if that weight loss has been all fat loss or some muscle wastage after a longer trip where nutrition's not great.

Seems that strength is maintained longer than top-end cardi fitness also -no science for that, just observation- so if you maintain your riding ability and drop 8-10kgs over a few months you'll notice enough difference for it to be highly motivating!

Thanks for that - Seeing as I have quite a lot of weight to lose i.e. as I am 105kg (def not all muscle!), by riding say 3-4 times a week, eating healthily (bla bla heard it before) and losing a good 10-15kg steadily, there shouldn't be too mush risk of loss of power should there? M

[mh24]

Without sounding like a hippy, its easy to forget what mindset and emotions can do for your fitness.

Best diet in the world that makes you feel like crap will make you ride like crap. Again, feeling overweight can have the same affect.

Lose weight, gain confidence, feel good in your own skin and suddenly the suck,... sucks a little less.

I ride fueled by pork pies, croissants, muesli bars and whatever my favourite cafe puts in their baps that day. Now food, diet and nutrition is my life, im insulin dependant diabetic so my life literally depends on my knowing what im eating. But i ride for enjoyment and enjoy certain foods, that matters more than calorie to weight to power ratios.

Was is not Stu that wrote how a true bikepacker was the bloke riding a 100k audax on nothing but a tunnocks tea cake? (Or something like that?)


Me? My wattage and speed up my local hill is at its best when i wear my best jersey and have "f**k Diabetes" written on my bike! Its all in the mind!

As a Type 2 Diabetic - I love your comments!! Must get a T-shirt like that!!

[Richard G]

Thanks for that - Seeing as I have quite a lot of weight to lose i.e. as I am 105kg (def not all muscle!), by riding say 3-4 times a week, eating healthily (bla bla heard it before) and losing a good 10-15kg steadily, there shouldn't be too mush risk of loss of power should there? M

Not until you get down to quite low bodyfat levels, unless you go insane with the calorie drop (which it doesn't sound like you are).

[mh24]

I can definitely attest at the losing weight and gaining performance thing, not bikepacking, but analogously.
I'm doing a lot of kettlebell work, and training for a Strong First kettlebell instructor certification.
Earlier this year I was doing Turkish get-ups with a 24kg bell, and beginning to feel like I owned that movement, so progressed up to a 28kg bell, and obviously it's hard
But along side that time of adding 4kg to the lift I also lost 8kg of bodyweight, so really I'm lifting 4kg less off the ground!!
Now I wouldn't recommend putting a kettlebell in a bike and cycling with it at all, but I'm sure you can see where it's going

Genius - I shall now wear a backpack of rocks, struggle....lose weight...remove back pack after a few weeks...be as light as a racing whippet...strong as an ox and bobs your uncle, fly up the hills. May have to watch any knee injuries!!

[mh24]

Thanks for that - Seeing as I have quite a lot of weight to lose i.e. as I am 105kg (def not all muscle!), by riding say 3-4 times a week, eating healthily (bla bla heard it before) and losing a good 10-15kg steadily, there shouldn't be too mush risk of loss of power should there? M

Not until you get down to quite low bodyfat levels, unless you go insane with the calorie drop (which it doesn't sound like you are).

No - I don't think I need to worry about drastic calorie loss!! Take it easy will be best - aim for 2-3 lbs a week and see how i get on. Thanks for your replies everyone - keep 'em coming!!!

[mh24]

And back to the original question......

Hey groovers - right...I am 106kg but reasonably fit (imo !!?). I am on a fitness / weight loss mission - Anyone got/ fancy making an equation of how much weight to lose to make hills feel easier!!?? Found those hills a b***ger last night!! M

At a starting weight of 100kg, every 5kg you loose you will find it noticeably less effort (still hard work mind, but less effort) to ride up any given hill.

As weight gain/loss is a slow process you wont' notice an immediate effect but month-by-month you will notice that it is taking less time to do a section on a ride and you ill fell a noticeable increase in momentum for every 5kg you lose.

Anything less than 5kg is "lost" in the overall effort, but as i said, 5kg steps are noticable.

For the thin out there who a questioning this... simply add 3 kg to you bike (bags, packs, lead weights, however you want) go ride and its not that noticeable (yes yo do notice as it "different" but it wont hold you back that much). On the other hand, adding 5kg you will notice. Adding say 7.5 kg is not much different to the 5 kg, but adding 10 kg is very noticeable compered to the 5kg.

So 5kg increments are noticeable...

Good luck with the weight loss - come on over to the fat fighters for some mutual support

Thanks very much - so 5kg chunks is what I shall work on. Am on the fat thread too now. m

[touch]

I've done a little bit of analysis for you using my strava data from 3 different local climbs (1 about 7mins long, 1 about 11mins long and 1 about 22mins long)
I've plotted my power to weight ratio (W/Kg) against vertical ascent metres per hour (VAM).


If I take starting weight as 80kg and can lose 5kg without losing any power, at 350w that's 0.3W/Kg increase, which equates to roughly 100metres increase on VAM.
There's a description of what VAM is here but I find it difficult to relate that to real-world speed/effort on a climb - so maybe my analysis isn't actually any help :p

[ianpv]

I'm about 71KG most of the time, sometimes going out to 73KG during high booze/low exercise periods and very occasionally dropping to high 60s when in race shape. I notice a pretty big difference between 71 and 69 kg, but I expect that is because the amount of training I'm doing to get to 69kg leads to big performance improvements. I'm 71 at the moment, not too worried about weight as am doing the HT550 and I figure I don't want to start too lean, and at 69 my wife starts to complain. I've never come close to thinking I'm losing power on the road or mtb, but some mates who ride track do stay heavier for this reason.

Depending on how tall you are, you've got a fair bit of weight to lose from 100+ kg, and you'll really reap the benefits of doing so. Of course, you'll just end up going faster so it won't get any easier at all! It does make a hell of a difference on the hills - Dan Empfield said "the trick is to keep losing weight until your friends and family ask you if you've been sick. Then you know you're within 10 pounds. iIf they start whispering to each other, wondering if you've got cancer or aids, you're within 5. When they actually do an intervention, you're at race weight."

[mh24]

I'm about 71KG most of the time, sometimes going out to 73KG during high booze/low exercise periods and very occasionally dropping to high 60s when in race shape. I notice a pretty big difference between 71 and 69 kg, but I expect that is because the amount of training I'm doing to get to 69kg leads to big performance improvements. I'm 71 at the moment, not too worried about weight as am doing the HT550 and I figure I don't want to start too lean, and at 69 my wife starts to complain. I've never come close to thinking I'm losing power on the road or mtb, but some mates who ride track do stay heavier for this reason.

Depending on how tall you are, you've got a fair bit of weight to lose from 100+ kg, and you'll really reap the benefits of doing so. Of course, you'll just end up going faster so it won't get any easier at all! It does make a hell of a difference on the hills - Dan Empfield said "the trick is to keep losing weight until your friends and family ask you if you've been sick. Then you know you're within 10 pounds. iIf they start whispering to each other, wondering if you've got cancer or aids, you're within 5. When they actually do an intervention, you're at race weight."

Love it!! People start to notice and to be complimentary when I get to 95kg - my ego will be blasted when I hit the 80's !!! Will keep you posted on how the school drop off mums point and whisper!!

[mh24]

.....Depending on how tall you are, you've got a fair bit of weight to lose from 100+ kg.........

..."I'm 2.78m (when standing on a metre high box!)"..

[mh24]

I've done a little bit of analysis for you using my strava data from 3 different local climbs (1 about 7mins long, 1 about 11mins long and 1 about 22mins long)
I've plotted my power to weight ratio (W/Kg) against vertical ascent metres per hour (VAM).


If I take starting weight as 80kg and can lose 5kg without losing any power, at 350w that's 0.3W/Kg increase, which equates to roughly 100metres increase on VAM.
There's a description of what VAM is here but I find it difficult to relate that to real-world speed/effort on a climb - so maybe my analysis isn't actually any help :p

Thanks - that's helped no end.......no really! I will just swallow a physics book!! Thanks for your effort and thoughts though - any help is appreciated - and I am a bit of a stats man!!

[Bearbonesnorm]

I'm 71 at the moment

Oldest HT rider ever then - well done

[Mart]

Thanks for that - Seeing as I have quite a lot of weight to lose i.e. as I am 105kg (def not all muscle!), by riding say 3-4 times a week, eating healthily (bla bla heard it before) and losing a good 10-15kg steadily, there shouldn't be too mush risk of loss of power should there? M

Not until you get down to quite low bodyfat levels, unless you go insane with the calorie drop (which it doesn't sound like you are).

No - I don't think I need to worry about drastic calorie loss!! Take it easy will be best - aim for 2-3 lbs a week and see how i get on. Thanks for your replies everyone - keep 'em coming!!!

If it's sustainable weight loss, through lifestyle change the I think 2-3lbs a week is quite a lot
Ive had 3 months of eating better and exercise and it's worked out on average around 1 lb per wk.
OK so i've NOT done low carb - just sensible, no snacking in between, keep off the rubbish
My body is changing slowly but still much more to lose

I've lost 6 kgs (13.2 lbs) in 13wks
I both swim and cycle. I fall off the wagon eating crap and drinking, everyone does BUT i get back on it and refocus
I keep a chart that motivates me so i can track progress. I can send it you if you PM me you'd email - could help you too

[psling]

One thing to remember and often overlooked when trying to reduce weight whilst increasing exercise is that muscle is denser than fat so weight will not drop off as fast when building muscle as it does when just reducing calories in. Simplistic I know (and probably covered above somewhere too!!).

[Richard G]

It's unlikely most here will be gaining any significant amount of muscle through cycling though... so don't use that as an excuse as to why you're not losing weight.

[Zippy]

Another thing to note. Power to weight is a good measure of things, until it gets windy - then it's all just about power (and maybe aero / frontal area....).

Also area under the curve is a better way of assessing things rather than peak power....ooops wrong forum

[Richard G]

Ugh... wind. My mortal enemy these days.

Get light they said, you'll be fast they said... until it gets windy and you can't actually get anywhere. :(