new to winter bike packing

[Fatboy68]

Im planning a 270 mile bike pack mid december. I'm limited for space due to using Apidura's bike packing system. Apart from the bivvy, sleeping bag, mat and Tarp, can anyone please advise on what to take. I've done some summer touring, just want to try it in the winter. Good for the soul ect..

Many thanks

[ianfitz]

Firstly will you be comfy and warm on the bike? Do you have warm gloves boots hat and riding kit? Waterproofs?

Then where will you stop? Bivy? Bothy? Multi day winter bivy in the UK could be, even, character building.

[Bearbonesnorm]

At 270 miles I'm going to assume 3 nights out?

What options does the route have for re-supply?

[ianfitz]

At 270 miles I'm going to assume 3 nights out?

What options does the route have for re-supply?

Good point.. Not like me to forget about food!

[ctznsmith]

Discounting what you've said above and what you'll be wearing whilst riding.

Food.

Warm dry clothes to sleep in.

Lights for bike plus head torch.

Gallows humour?

[Scattamah]

Winter bikepacking is pretty much the same as summer bikepacking in the UK. I'm presuming you already carry spares/tools/medkit.

- Expect to be wet, but wearing more layers (layers that are easy to get on/off and pack down well);
- Make sure your dry bags actually keep stuff dry - double bag where necessary;
- Bonus points for your sleeping clothes to double as riding gear on the last day if you're not planning on drying your kit somewhere;
- Consider reproofing your waterproofs;
- As any hoopy frood knows...know where your towel is.

Greetz

S.

[Joshvegas]

I'd be trying an over nighter somewhere nearby your home to see if you'll actually manage it.

And too see what works for you.

[padonbike]

Some seriously good advice from Scattamah.

[Bearbonesnorm]

If I were heading out today (which probably counts as winter) I'd have the following, excluding food.

Cumulus 350 quilt (would take Enlightened quilt if it were cold).
Exped Synmat UL
Tigoat Kestral bivvy bag
Klymit pillow + MYOG pillowcase
SMD Gatewood cape or bicycle 3.5 with shower curtain + pole, pegs

Down jacket (weightweight rather than full on winter)
Down hat
Spare socks (1pr to sleep in)
Fleece long-john things

Rab waterproof smock
TN tuff-bag goretex over mitts
Buff type thing

8g stove + windshield
450ml mug
2l Platypuss bladder - empty
Lighter
Sawyer mini
Tooth brush and mini toothpaste stolen from dentist's reception

That would be pretty much it, although lights, spares, map I'm taking as a given. I'm sure someone will remind me if I've forgotten something.

[whitestone]

If I were heading out today (which probably counts as winter) I'd have the following, excluding food.

Cumulus 350 quilt (would take Enlightened quilt if it were cold).
Exped Synmat UL
...

Interesting that you would take a relatively lightweight quilt/sleeping bag, presumably because the mat is being pretty effective? I know that the current temps are somewhat unseasonable but I'm assuming that you are happy with the above system even in cooler, though not Siberian, temps.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Interesting that you would take a relatively lightweight quilt/sleeping bag, presumably because the mat is being pretty effective? I know that the current temps are somewhat unseasonable but I'm assuming that you are happy with the above system even in cooler, though not Siberian, temps.

I view 350g of down in a quilt as 550g in a sleeping bag, so for me, it's good to around zero. Never had any issues with the Synmat on any ground that wasn't frozen ... and even then, it wasn't too bad.

[Scattamah]

Yup...Stu's got it pretty well nailed on the kit front. Very similar bicycle here, just with different vendors.

The only thing I alter from summer to winter is the Lusso Repel tights instead of cotton boxers, an extra tshirt to sleep in, Sealskinz Belgian Beanie instead of a normal beanie and Sealskinz cold weather gloves instead of the layered system I use during warmer months (Icebreaker liners, Extremeties running gloves and Giro mitts in various configs).

If I know I'm guaranteed wet feet, I'll use summer shoes and deal with the fallout. Otherwise, Shimano winter boots are on the meat slabs but they're awful if you get water in 'em. Slushy buckets of cold water...ugh. If you find your shoes keep the water out but your socks are wicking in the liquid, try some Trekmates XT Goretex gaters - this can slow down the wicking process although won't stop a full blown dunking finishing you off.

I used to hate winter cycling until I got the right gear and now it's one of my favourite times of the year - especially those sub zero clear days. Watch out for the black ice.

Greetz

S.

[ctznsmith]

*ahem* this might be shameless self promotion but if we're talking about what to wear whilst riding (if it's wet) then I wrote this yesterday.
http://punkrockbikeclub.com/2015/11/rot-and-rain/

Essentially plus one for gaiters.

[Artie Fufkin]

I have to agree with Stuart on the quilt front. I have the same one and have had it down to about zero. Merino base layer, down beanie and Rab hot-socks!
Hasn't let me down yet.
We shall see how they perform this weekend. I will be taking just about what Stu has listed, just some different manufacturers. Probably a bit more cooking stuff and definitely a hip flask to warm the cockles of me heart!!!
Cheers.
Adam

[ianfitz]

I'm heading out tonight in to the drizzle and wind. Marshalling a fell race tomorrow so will be in position from 9pm-noon next day.

Will be in a trail star possibly with a shower curtain up. A borah wind proof bivy. A PhD 300g fill custom bag and on a neoair xtherm. I expect to be warm

[Moder-dye]

That gatewood Cape/tarp looks interesting. Anyone know how it compares to a trailstar or use in open windy conditions? I live in a treeless place.

Is the shower curtain for additional coverage on an open tarp front / ground sheet or something else?

Been thinking about a trailstar for a while. I have a lightweight tent and other square/rectangular tarps and bivy bag, but not a tarp set up I'd really trust in a good blow on a long trip. I like to be under a shelter not just in a bivy bag.

Cheers

[Bearbonesnorm]

That gatewood Cape/tarp looks interesting. Anyone know how it compares to a trailstar or use in open windy conditions? I live in a treeless place.

Gatewood isn't bad but it's not nearly as good as a TS in heavy winds ... set a TS at 1m and it'll shrug of just about anything.

Is the shower curtain for additional coverage on an open tarp front / ground sheet or something else?

Think of it as a door for an open fronted tarp: http://www.bearbonesbikepacking.co.uk/s ... er-curtain

Been thinking about a trailstar for a while. I have a lightweight tent and other square/rectangular tarps and bivy bag, but not a tarp set up I'd really trust in a good blow on a long trip. I like to be under a shelter not just in a bivy bag.

TS sounds just the ticket, the wind just sails over the top of it. Not the lightest thing or smallest packing shelter but it does offer lots of room.

[Moder-dye]

Cheers looks like I need to bite the bullet and get an order in!

[boxelder]

@ctznsmith - lots of common sense in your writing, but surely you wear your waterproof trousers over your gaiters?

[Cheeky Monkey]

I think they do a smaller version of the Trailstar now, if weight and size were an issue to you.

[Moder-dye]

Yeh had look on the site and there are 3 sizes, probably go with the smaller one, just waiting for approval from the boss. Just had our whopping 1% pay increase in the payslip, but with the back dating it means I have the money for one

[redefined_cycles]

Interesting that you would take a relatively lightweight quilt/sleeping bag, presumably because the mat is being pretty effective? I know that the current temps are somewhat unseasonable but I'm assuming that you are happy with the above system even in cooler, though not Siberian, temps.

I view 350g of down in a quilt as 550g in a sleeping bag, so for me, it's good to around zero. Never had any issues with the Synmat on any ground that wasn't frozen ... and even then, it wasn't too bad.

Just been searching for something (price and model of PHD bag I bought off here some years ago) from the last as am considering an upgrade (or might end up as a downgrade inadvertently) to my PHD bag which I bought off Ian Fitz many moons ago but hardly used as its a hot bag in summer) to allow winter conditions....

But came across the chief BB quote above. So am thinking that maybe my upgrade should be to a quilt afterall...

But please can some explain it if poss (how 350g in a quilt is viewed by the pros as same as 550g in a bag???

Mucho gracias

Shafiq

[middleagedmadness]

The down in the back of a bag is pretty useless once your sleeping on it and it's squished down so your really only using the top down and possibly all of the legs as a insulator , took my quilt on FEBS Bivi 10 degrees when we nodded off but woke to a massive ground frost so had obviously dropped to close to zero or below but never felt it through the night ,a good mat is needed mind ,used a down mat last year but started using a synmat7 UL this year and it was good enough that last night

[whitestone]

You "lose" or rather don't need the down needed for the back of the bag and the cowl to go around your head. I've a Cumulus 150 quilt (375g total weight) and a PHD Minimus 200 (430g total weight). There may be a clue in the names of the products Both are rated to roughly the same temperatures, 4/5C so that's 55g difference with the assumption that the down being used is equivalent.

Going to warmer bags/quilts, the Cumulus 350 is rated to -4C and the PHD Minimus 400 is rated to -5C about a 70g difference in overall weight so somewhere in the 50g difference in weight of down.

I've posted several times that the Cumulus 150 and PHD Minimus are a good combo as either one is fine in summer and combined they are good to -5/6C which is fine for most UK winters. You'll get the occasional colder night but they are fairly rare. The weight of the two together is only slightly more than an equivalently rated PHD bag. My wife has the Cumulus 350 and that combined with the Minimus would really cover all UK conditions: bag in summer; quilt in early autumn/late spring; both together in winter.

[redefined_cycles]

Excellwnt. Thanks Bob... u might just have saved me selling one of my most valuable assets bought at bargain basement prices...