Going tubeless...

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petemaz
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Going tubeless...

Post by petemaz »

Well I've always been a 'late adopter' of bike technology, so only recently took the plunge into tubeless. After the usual frustrations with mounting tyres, it looks like I'm pretty much good to go and just have a couple of things I'd like to ask...
Pressure - what do folks run at, I've read you can/should go lower with tubeless on a gravel bike, around 25/30psi on front, touch more on rear?
Also, on overnighters away from the track pump and DIY inflator, how many co2 cartridges do you take with you? Assuming most take an emergency inner tube, but do you take a small pump?

Thanks as always 👍
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Jurassic
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Jurassic »

I personally run my tyres at 35-40 psi depending on conditions (they're 43mm wide Pananracer Gravel King SKs). I carry a spare tube, and a combined mini pump/CO2 inflator and two 16g canisters. I also carry some bacon strips in case of a big puncture and a bit of chopped up milk carton to use as an emergency tyre boot.
Lazarus
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Lazarus »

About 30psi

I carry a smallish pump- in reality you are unlikely to be able to do a trail side tubeless fix* and re seat so I dont bother carrying anything to try
C02 cartridges are just an uncessary part of our throw away culture so I dont use them and never have - YMMV


* I mean reseating an unseated tyre I dont mean pumping it up after a puncture.
jobro
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by jobro »

I've been running all off road bikes tubeless for about 7 years now. Tyre pressures obvs depends on many factors. Enve do a good calculator. FWIW I run 35psi on 42mm tyres and 21 psi on 55mm.
I still think tubeless is a real faff that is only just justifiable. I can't believe someone can't develop a tube with latex like performance, Butyl ease of use and still be largely puncture proof. A tyre liner of some sort?
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Bearlegged
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Bearlegged »

Much the same. Anywhere between 30-40 PSI depending how long it is since I last pipes the tyres up, some Dynaplugs, a spare tube and a mini pump.
ton
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by ton »

only been tubeless since january. and it has been ok so far, fingers crossed.
40 psi on a 2.25 tyre set up. but it is carrying a bit of a load.

2 spare tubes and a mini pump on the bike. if i have a air loss, i will probably go back to tubes, i cant do with faff.
petemaz
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by petemaz »

Thanks for the responses, very useful. It seems that everyone does tubeless in a slightly different way... I completely agree that tubeless is a right old faff - saying that, it wasn't quite the nightmare I was expecting it to be. After a string of punctures this year, I finally gave in went down the tubeless route. Fingers crossed it goes ok :-bd
Hamish
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Hamish »

jobro wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 5:57 pm I've been running all off road bikes tubeless for about 7 years now. Tyre pressures obvs depends on many factors. Enve do a good calculator. FWIW I run 35psi on 42mm tyres and 21 psi on 55mm.
I still think tubeless is a real faff that is only just justifiable. I can't believe someone can't develop a tube with latex like performance, Butyl ease of use and still be largely puncture proof. A tyre liner of some sort?
I’m relatively new to tubeless. I have been running some bikes tubeless for couple of years. I must admit I haven’t found it to be too much of a faff... yet! What makes it a faff? What things go wrong?

I love being able to ride thorny paths without worry so am very happy, so far, to be tubeless.
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Jurassic
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Jurassic »

Yeah tubeless is great until it isn't (which is a sort of stupid thing to say but is quite appropriate with tubeless I think). I see it as a bit of a challenge tbh, I spent a year riding my most recent fat bike wheels with tubes in as I couldn't get them to go up tubeless (despite having run my previous two pairs of wheels tubeless without issues). They were fine with tubes in but my failure annoyed me to the extent that I eventually had to try again. This time I managed it (albeit with some extra faffing needed) so now all my bikes are running without tubes. Does it make a huge difference? No not really. :lol:
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Bearlegged
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Bearlegged »

Forgot to mention, my toolkit also includes some PowerFlex super glue.
ScotRoutes
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by ScotRoutes »

The only time I've had "faff" was with my fatbike and that was due to the single skin rims. P Nuts solved that problem. That's also the only time I've needed the super-duper reservoir pump I bought. Every other time (including today) I've just used my normal track pump.
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BigdummySteve
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by BigdummySteve »

It makes a huge difference where I ride, hawthorns mean punctures are a certainty, my record was 14 and a walk home. I’ll often hear the ‘ tink tink tink’ sound of a hawthorn twig hitting the fork or chainstay, I stop, pull them out and ride off.
As others have mentioned reseating a tubeless tyre in the field is going to be problematic, the rim tape beds down and the tyre stretches a little, you might be lucky with co2, can’t say I’ve tried it. My plan is plugs, extra sealant then a tube. I also carry thread, patches and super glue.
Don’t forget to check your sealant every now and then, it does dry out and carry spare sealant, muc-off do a sealant which comes in a nice soft pouch which is easy to stow and has a built in tube, very handy.
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ScotRoutes
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by ScotRoutes »

I took the tyres off my old wheels today and re-fitted them to my new wheels. The tyres still had fluid in and I managed to transfer them with it in situ. The tyres re-seated with the track pump and a couple of minutes of the Stans shake had them completely sealed. Tools used; one tyre lever, one pump. It's not always going to be so simple but it's rarely difficult.
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whitestone
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by whitestone »

You are trading faff out on the trail for faff in the warmth and dry of your garage/shed/kitchen.

The faff is typically frustration rather than anything else: most times it's straightforward but sometimes it just won't work. I fitted a couple of the same tyres to the same rims, one went up first time and stayed inflated without needing sealant (though I did add it a couple of days later) but the other took nearly five days to sort out. The crux in setting up tubeless is getting the taping right so it's worth taking care with that step. As Steve says, check the sealant every now and again, more often in hotter weather.

I've only had one time when I couldn't sort out a fix on the trail - I'd dinged the rim so there was no way it was going to seal.

Toolkit consists of Sahmurai Sword anchovy applicator and rasp; the anchovies themselves; CO2 cylinder and valve; spare valve and valve inner; flexible super glue; tyre boot, needle and thread for longer splits.

CO2 does work with tubeless sealant, it's the thermal shock of pumping up a tyre not any chemical reaction between CO2 and the sealant. Turn the wheel so the valve is somewhere between 11 & 1 o'clock, leave it a minute or two to let the sealant settle as far away from the valve as possible then add the CO2.
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Lazarus
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Lazarus »

The crux in setting up tubeless is getting t̶h̶e̶ ̶t̶a̶p̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶r̶i̶g̶h̶t̶ ̶s̶o̶ ̶i̶t̶'̶s̶ ̶w̶o̶r̶t̶h̶ ̶t̶a̶k̶i̶n̶g̶ ̶c̶a̶r̶e̶ ̶w̶i̶t̶h̶ ̶t̶h̶a̶t̶ ̶s̶t̶e̶p̶ scotsroute to do it as he has never had any faff
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In Reverse
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by In Reverse »

Crikey, some high tyre pressures up in here :???:

20 - 25psi for me on a 2.4" tyre. 18psi on a 3"
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RIP
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by RIP »

In Reverse wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:35 pm Crikey, some high tyre pressures up in here :???:

20 - 25psi for me on a 2.4" tyre. 18psi on a 3"
Mmm... Bob way back in 2014 explained thusly: "Tyre pressures are a whole different mega-thread :lol: A starting point would be your weight in Kg (to the nearest 5kg) divided by ten gives the PSI, so 75kg/10 = 7.5psi and yes you need to be thinking in increments of 0.5psi or less!". Admittedly on fatties but still. 1psi anyone?

Reg still happy with his tubes needless to say :wink: .
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petemaz
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by petemaz »

Again, great replies, thank you - stuff for me to think about.

One other thing, how much sealant per tyre, any rules on this? I stuck one x 2oz/57ml bottle in each wheel, will that be enough? Tyres are Panaracer Gravel King SK 45mm.
ScotRoutes
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by ScotRoutes »

petemaz wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 9:05 pm Again, great replies, thank you - stuff for me to think about.

One other thing, how much sealant per tyre, any rules on this? I stuck one x 2oz/57ml bottle in each wheel, will that be enough? Tyres are Panaracer Gravel King SK 45mm.
That should be enough, especially if you already have a good seal. You should still hear some slopping around. If you don't, no harm in adding a bit more.


Pressures - 35-40psi on 640x47, 25-20psi on 27.5x2.40", 15-18psi on 27.5x3.0", 8-10psi on 26x4.40".

TBH, mostly I just give them a squeeze. I rarely use a pressure gauge and I've no idea how accurate the one on my pump is but those figures are what I wold set them to if I was using it.
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whitestone
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by whitestone »

RIP wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:55 pm
In Reverse wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:35 pm Crikey, some high tyre pressures up in here :???:

20 - 25psi for me on a 2.4" tyre. 18psi on a 3"
Mmm... Bob way back in 2014 explained thusly: "Tyre pressures are a whole different mega-thread :lol: A starting point would be your weight in Kg (to the nearest 5kg) divided by ten gives the PSI, so 75kg/10 = 7.5psi and yes you need to be thinking in increments of 0.5psi or less!". Admittedly on fatties but still. 1psi anyone?

Reg still happy with his tubes needless to say :wink: .
Were it that long ago :oops:

Generally tyre pressures follow the ideal gas law, PV/T = constant. Take temperature out of the equation (it's measured in Kelvin so a ten degree change in nearly 300 isn't that significant) and you have Pressure * Volume is a constant. So if you've a fatter, i.e. more voluminous tyre then you need a lower pressure.

The above quote is for fat tyres, the Stans formula for normal MTB tyres is weight in pounds / 7 then slightly more for the rear slightly less for the front. 75kg is 165lbs so that gives 23.5psi. Don't know if there's an equivalent for gravel and road tyres.

Late edit: those are just starting points. I'll drop pressure until the tyres feel squirmy then put a bit back in. Just get a feel, literally, for what your desired pressure feels like - squeezing the tyre or pushing in with your thumb for example.
Last edited by whitestone on Mon Apr 05, 2021 9:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Jurassic
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Jurassic »

In Reverse wrote: Sun Apr 04, 2021 8:35 pm Crikey, some high tyre pressures up in here :???:

20 - 25psi for me on a 2.4" tyre. 18psi on a 3"
Depends on the tyres though dunnit? 35-40psi for my 700x43 gravel tyres, 18-24psi for my 29er tyres (2.5/2.6) and 6-8psi for my fat bike tyres (4.0/4.3).
petemaz
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by petemaz »


That should be enough, especially if you already have a good seal. You should still hear some slopping around. If you don't, no harm in adding a bit more.


Pressures - 35-40psi on 640x47, 25-20psi on 27.5x2.40", 15-18psi on 27.5x3.0", 8-10psi on 26x4.40".

TBH, mostly I just give them a squeeze. I rarely use a pressure gauge and I've no idea how accurate the one on my pump is but those figures are what I wold set them to if I was using it.

Thanks Scotroutes 👍
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Bearlegged
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by Bearlegged »

Aye, good point on context for the pressures.
35-40ish for 700*42c
No idea for 29*2.4", as my track pump doesn't seem to properly register anything below 30 PSI, but I'd guess they're usually between 20-25.
mattpage
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by mattpage »

For me, low 30's gravel bike at 42mm, low 20's MTB. I've gone lower with a tyre insert with some success.

I'll take: tube, glueless patches, tyre boot, big co2 or 2x 16g and small pump.
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nagasaki45
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Re: Going tubeless...

Post by nagasaki45 »

Yesterday on a 35km ride I've punctured 3 times! I think that's the end of tubes for me. Pulled the trigger and ordered a stans tubeless conversion kit. Hopefully will manage to set up the tyres with the floor pump.

Some of you mentioned checking regularly how much sealant is still in there. How do you do that?
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