You can put a positive spin on owt.
Moderators: Bearbonesnorm, Taylor, Chew
- Bearbonesnorm
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You can put a positive spin on owt.
Just reading about a waterproof jacket and in the description it says "Low breathability to increase core temperature when moving slowly or stationary"
Proof that you really can put a positive spin on pretty much anything
Proof that you really can put a positive spin on pretty much anything
May the bridges you burn light your way
- johnnystorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
I'm surprised they didn't also mention about the weight loss benefits of this feature!
- TheBrownDog
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
Just being honest I reckon. So much outdoor stuff over-promises and under delivers on its breathability.
I'm just going outside ...
- Bearbonesnorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
Honest? They've made it sound like a real bonus which in itself is somewhat misleading as a lack of breathability to will do absolutely nothing to 'increase core temperature'. More likely the opposite once you begin to sweat.Just being honest I reckon.
May the bridges you burn light your way
Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
depends on who or what it is aimed at
Probably not a bad feature if a wateproof for say someone fishing or wtatching football awful for someone cycling
Probably not a bad feature if a wateproof for say someone fishing or wtatching football awful for someone cycling
- Bearbonesnorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
The adventure racing crowd.Probably not a bad feature if a wateproof for say someone fishing or wtatching football awful for someone cycling
May the bridges you burn light your way
Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
In that case yes its a totally terrible idea that is utterly stupid
- johnnystorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
There's an upside to being warm, not one to being sweaty. Does breathability have to equal less warm?
Can we see the product in question? I'm intrigued!
- voodoo_simon
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
That falls under the 'it's not a bug it's a feature' category.
Think of it as a beta version jacket.
Softies have been using this excuse for ages.
(I expect one will be a long to expand? )
Think of it as a beta version jacket.
Softies have been using this excuse for ages.
(I expect one will be a long to expand? )
Zazen - nothing happens next this is it.
- Bearbonesnorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
No reason why a breathable windproof fabric would be less warm than a non-breathable or less breathable one.Does breathability have to equal less warm?
I can see the angle they're using and I myself have used bin bags to produce a vapour barrier effect and thus a warm if somewhat damp micro-climate but it's better worn next to the skin ... and to be honest, only when things are really dire.
https://ratracestore.com/clothing/water ... 2wZy3JkzjQ
May the bridges you burn light your way
Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
They do say
This emergency waterproof is ideal when you’re moving slowly or stationary
So for emergencies it could be better especially if it's actually waterproof, unlike the majority of breathable waterproofs I've owned... but then if it's just for emergency use bin bag material would be lighter and cheaper
This emergency waterproof is ideal when you’re moving slowly or stationary
So for emergencies it could be better especially if it's actually waterproof, unlike the majority of breathable waterproofs I've owned... but then if it's just for emergency use bin bag material would be lighter and cheaper
Adventure without risk is Disneyland - Bikemonger
- johnnystorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
That's what I thought, apart from people selling literal "wet suits" I've never seen anyone try and pitch that feature.Bearbonesnorm wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:15 pmNo reason why a breathable windproof fabric would be less warm than a non-breathable or less breathable one.Does breathability have to equal less warm?
I can see the angle they're using and I myself have used bin bags to produce a vapour barrier effect and thus a warm if somewhat damp micro-climate but it's better worn next to the skin ... and to be honest, only when things are really dire.
https://ratracestore.com/clothing/water ... 2wZy3JkzjQ
My insta feed has been under a barrage of their promoted posts. I took a quick look but nothing seemed worth a second glance.
- johnnystorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
johnnystorm wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:27 pmThat's what I thought, apart from people selling literal "wet suits" I've never seen anyone try and pitch that feature.Bearbonesnorm wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:15 pmNo reason why a breathable windproof fabric would be less warm than a non-breathable or less breathable one.Does breathability have to equal less warm?
I can see the angle they're using and I myself have used bin bags to produce a vapour barrier effect and thus a warm if somewhat damp micro-climate but it's better worn next to the skin ... and to be honest, only when things are really dire.
https://ratracestore.com/clothing/water ... 2wZy3JkzjQ
My insta feed has been under a barrage of their promoted posts. I took a quick look but nothing seemed worth a second glance.
*edit* nope, that was another brand.
- Bearbonesnorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
What makes it better? I wasn't aware that damp clothes was a bonus in emergency situationsSo for emergencies it could be better
May the bridges you burn light your way
Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
I rode past their hq on last year's Dales Divide, this doesn't add anything to this discussion though
Adventure without risk is Disneyland - Bikemonger
Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
Well, you'd be damp and warmer than in a breathable one? If breathable works by letting water vapour through it must also have latent heat with it? Certainly warmer to keep the water vapour in than to have freezing cold rain coming in, which always seems to be the case these daysBearbonesnorm wrote: ↑Thu Mar 19, 2020 9:30 pm What makes it better? I wasn't aware that damp clothes was a bonus in emergency situations
I'm sure when I was in the scouts and had an old school non-breathable waterproof I might have been damp but I don't remember shivering uncontrollably as I end up doing now, but perhaps I've just blanked it from my memory
Adventure without risk is Disneyland - Bikemonger
Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
what he said the escaping water is vapour and therefore both warmer than the ambient air and also posseing energy you gave it from your heat ; energy/heat is escaping with a breathable that is not with a non brethable
Will it be noticeably warmer when sedantry ?
Not a clue
Will it be colder than a breathable if you get damp inside- almost definetly
Disappointingly no weights stated on the link and i have no idea what "rat race" is
Will it be noticeably warmer when sedantry ?
Not a clue
Will it be colder than a breathable if you get damp inside- almost definetly
Disappointingly no weights stated on the link and i have no idea what "rat race" is
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
I remember reading this article a while back, yes OK its Bike Radar but not everything on these big corporate websites is necessarily bullshit:
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/prot ... -the-rain/
Basically saying not to worry about getting wet from rain, but a lightweight windproof outer layer is going to do a better job of keeping you warm while moving. You can add an insulation underneath for when you are not moving and not generating as much internal body heat.
Layering of clothing is very similar to the way that we (aspire to) build climate responsive houses which must respond to a variety of different weather conditions. We have a layer of insulation to keep warmth in and heat out, a breathable water proof membrane to let moist air out but not let rain in, and then an outer cladding for durable protection against impact from rain, sun, snow, hail. Then windows that we can open to control ventilation and release heat.
Back to the original comment of this thread, someone recently posted a link to a Bill Hicks bit about his cynical view on marketing. I just think about that everytime someone puts a spin on a product.
https://www.bikeradar.com/features/prot ... -the-rain/
Basically saying not to worry about getting wet from rain, but a lightweight windproof outer layer is going to do a better job of keeping you warm while moving. You can add an insulation underneath for when you are not moving and not generating as much internal body heat.
Layering of clothing is very similar to the way that we (aspire to) build climate responsive houses which must respond to a variety of different weather conditions. We have a layer of insulation to keep warmth in and heat out, a breathable water proof membrane to let moist air out but not let rain in, and then an outer cladding for durable protection against impact from rain, sun, snow, hail. Then windows that we can open to control ventilation and release heat.
Back to the original comment of this thread, someone recently posted a link to a Bill Hicks bit about his cynical view on marketing. I just think about that everytime someone puts a spin on a product.
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
Also...
Really? Goes against all my experience.a smock design makes this easy to get on and off in poor conditions
- Bearbonesnorm
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Re: You can put a positive spin on owt.
Oh yes, I'd much prefer a very waterproof jacket that isn't quite as breathable as keeping gallons of rain out in return for a little sweat in, always seems like a fair trade especially over long days or multi-days. However, we have nothing here to make us think that this jacket is in anyway more waterproof than a breathable one with the same HH and general features.Well, you'd be damp and warmer than in a breathable one? If breathable works by letting water vapour through it must also have latent heat with it? Certainly warmer to keep the water vapour in than to have freezing cold rain coming in, which always seems to be the case these days
May the bridges you burn light your way