Rescue me!

[BigdummySteve]

I’m currently sitting in a broken van awaiting the AA, no great drama, I had phone reception and a full mug of coffee and most importantly 4G to browse the BB website while wait for the van to tell me the obvious (clutch fooked)

Sunday I was in a very different location, trampling across a trackless moor a long way from any civilisation. If id have put a foot down a rabbit hole and broken an ankle id have been in big trouble.
No phone and no chance of anyone else being silly enough to head my way for a very long time.
I’m sure they could have me/remains using last cell location but I’d not had a signal for a long time

Similar situation in Clocaenog Forest after the wayfarer event, flying down forest tracks at 30mph the thought that I’d not seen a soul for a long time and I backed off a little.
On the Spanish c2c we were in very remote locations but there were 3 of us.
We take spares to fix mechanical breakdowns and assume a walkout if it’s terminal.
These few occasions have made me vaguely wonder if it’s worth getting a spot or inreach, I don’t do solo trips in the wilderness very often so it would be an expensive insurance on a trip by trip basis, just wondering what others thoughts are? Accept the risk and perhaps be more careful when remote and without phone coverage or do you restrict solo rides to safer areas or just go la la la to any voices muttering warnings in your head?

[middleagedmadness]

Wife insisted I got a spot as I'm slightly accident prone and when I have one it normally involves a year off work ,I refused "not paying that to be used every couple of months" so before I tried the bigbear I had a little box arrive with a spot and subs paid for,not sure if she loves me or wants definate proof I'm dead a Nd not just run away .After my last accident I can understand her wanting a bit of piece of mind and as with the reason I stopped climbing it would be totally selfish if I just carried on regardless

[RIP]

Good topic Steve. We talked it over a while ago didn't we but worth a re-visit. My immediate reaction was that the very thread title may generate some interesting/forthright views - I suspect mine may somewhat mirror Stu's so I'm keen to hear his. Plainly there's many stories on Here where people have been 'saved' by a tracker. Can't be flippant about it but on balance I personally prefer not. On solo jaunts I would be doing 29mph instead of 30mph, etc etc. Ie 'more careful'. Idealistically I want to minimise gizmo distractions on rides. Yes I know exactly what responses that will get. What effect does the tracker have on the people you expect/wish/want to be watching? etc etc. The topic has so many undercurrents than just the obvious 'find me'.

Hope the clutch gets sorted! Not your van though I guess!

[ScotRoutes]

I have a Spot. Even some of my regular rides will have me out of phone range and I'll not be sticking to any planned route.

When riding with other folk I tend not to bother with it.

There's certainly an argument that it might lead one to take additional risks/be less cautious knowing that there is the increased chance of help.

On the other hand, if something was to happen and MRT was required I'd rather they knew exactly where to find me and not be putting them at risk combing the mountains for me unnecessarily.

Plus the emergency/SOS feature could be crucial in saving someone else's life.

[Bearbonesnorm]

This might sound like bollox but bear with me .... i feel that the odds of getting into serious trouble are quite slim and I have a far greater chance of needing assistance riding on the road to Newtown. Personally, I've never felt the need for a tracker or even a phone when I'm out. Foolish? I live in a fairly remote and sparsley populated area but the hils are my friends, I'm part of them, I feel at home amongst them. They don't scare me, they calm me.

Should something 'bad' befall me while out there, I'll rely on experience and maybe a dash of luck to resolve the issue but if those measures fail, then I'll die happily amongst my friends.

I'm not gung-ho with regard to safety but neither do I need a crutch in order to enjoy the hills and all within them. I sometimes think people would be better spending their Spot sub on a 2 day REC first aid course instead.

[RIP]

ah... perfect

PS. taken Routes' point re not messing MR etc about if called but....

[whitestone]

But Stu, what about the deranged axe-wielding murderer? I mean, he could be hiding around any corner in the middle of nowhere just waiting to pounce.

[RIP]

If there was, you would indeed be dead, but on the plus side you'd be immortalised with a fantastic headline!

[Bearbonesnorm]

I do take onboard the MR bit but there's no one to call them and besides, we don't have a MR team here*



*yes slightly flippant but isn't that the British way?

[dlovett]

Even in the deep Saff, we have areas with no mobile coverage. When I was starting out riding again I got a puncture and had no tools or tubes (pre-tubless days). I was miles from anywhere, well as much as you can get down here and the weather was turning nasty. I was vaguely near my parents and thought I'll call Mum and see if she could pick me up. Of course that was no phone service. However I did have a spot so I hit one of he buttons I had set up that messaged my family saying I have a non life threatening problem please come and find me, I will head for the nearest road. I did indeed start walking to a road and half and hour later my mum appeared in the car with sandwiches and warm clothing. They have got silly expensive now, but (see my thread about the discount code) still work out to about the cost a a couple of posh pints per month.

That day it saved my a long cold walk, one day it might actually save my or somebody's life.

[dlovett]

This has now reminded me to actually set up all of those messages on the new account.

[RIP]

This lake of discussion has quite thin ice, but... Interesting on this forum of expert outdoors(wo)men and practitioners of self-reliance that we're even talking about it. I'm not fully at ease 'expecting' [very expensive in cost and people] rescue to be provided whenever I go out. If we take all the precautions and experience and stuff we always go on about as Stu says you're far more at risk in the motor (100 times less in my train ) on the way there. Hmm.

[Mart]

something that has stuck with me since my early mountaineering days in Scotland was self reliance
the ability to self rescue and get yourself out of a situation to safety

OK lets face it, in the UK your never really more than a few hours from the nearest road.

When with others, you have the ability of the group to cope with more issues that might occur
However
When solo there are some situations that might be not be possible. Back to self reliance

I did purchase a inReach this year, not so much for my own benefit, but so that others wouldn't worry and could see that I was still moving
The chances of me ever pressing that SOS button are probably very remote, but its there should the unthinkable happen

[Bearbonesnorm]

When I was starting out riding again I got a puncture and had no tools or tubes (pre-tubless days).

Really, that's just poor prep on your part. A long walk in the rain would have taught you a valuable and long lasting lesson



•yep, I'm all heart and compassion me

[dlovett]

When I was starting out riding again I got a puncture and had no tools or tubes (pre-tubless days).

Really, that's just poor prep on your part. A long walk in the rain would have taught you a valuable and long lasting lesson



•yep, I'm all heart and compassion me

You are quite right, I always take sandwiches with me now, in case I have a long wait for mum to rescue me!!

[Bearbonesnorm]

You are quite right, I always take sandwiches with me now, in case I have a long wait for mum to rescue me!!

Ooh, Paddington Bear School of bikepacking - I like it

[BigdummySteve]

When I qualified as a skydiver initially I couldn’t afford kit with a cypress( an automatic reserve opener) if I don’t open my canopy or reserve I’d die.
This gave me a respect for the sport and even after I bought one I was still a lot more cautious about who I jumped with etc and possibly remained a safer jumper.
I’m with stu, I feel at home out in the hills and take sufficient kit to cope with most situations.
I do wonder if having a get out of jail card would alter my behaviour. I certainly saw it in the skydiving crowd.

I got the cypress AFTER I’d learnt to keep myself safe, the fact that for some time I’d been fully exposed the the risks altered my approach, I wonder if the same applies with spots/I reach?

[Asposium]

I’m with stu, I feel at home out in the hills and take sufficient kit to cope with most situations.
I do wonder if having a get out of jail card would alter my behaviour. I certainly saw it in the skydiving crowd.

sometimes bad 5hit happens
does a spot /inReach make one more risk taking? probably not
could it save your life if the 5hit hits the fan? yes

[Ray Young]

If I had the cash to spare then yes I'd get one but I don't so I'll carry on taking the same risks solo mtb'ing that I've taken for the last 30 years albeit with a mobile phone now which I suppose slightly reduces the risk. It always amazes me what people are capable of when in life/death situations. The guy who sawed his own arm off, the guy who crawled two miles down a hillside with a compound leg fracture so as to get onto a road. Like Stu says, if your going to die then what better way than doing something you love. Quite some time ago I read about one of Britain's top climbers who died falling 20 feet off a very easy route he was soloing because a hold broke. Life is full of risks.

[Mart]

Having my inReach hasn't made me take more risks - its just given me another means of rescue
I still ride the same way, regardless of whether I carry it or not

[Bearbonesnorm]

I'm thinking this is simply a personal character issue and your character will reflect the choices you make - no correct answer, simply different ones.

[Lazarus]

your going to die then what better way than doing something you love

Is it die 35 years after you were rescued by using your device having seen your kids grow up, have grandkids and ride many many more miles and routes in the period that you were rescued?

[dlovett]

in Terms of behaviour, it alters nothing for me. Once you turn it on, it's not like you even notice it's on your pack. At the end of the day it's to help you in the event of something really bad going on. Now I can't imaging most people would think OH I have a spot so if I try that gap jump and break every bone as I can get a rescue sorted. Most people won't want to break every bone in their body, or they will accept that is the risk. Having someone to pick you up doesn't really increase the odds of you doing or not doing it.

[middleagedmadness]

I think most people me included have it for the ones at home ,I loved having very little phone coverage on the big bear and the wife was happy as I could send her a message telling her I'd call when I can so I knew she wouldn't be stressing at home ,what Lazarus says is also true for me ,I came close with my fall 45ft onto my head and come away with a shattered leg ,it did bring it home a little I'd like to see my kids grow up or I wouldn't want them having to look after me for the rest of my life ,so the s.o.s button dosent really factor into as I'm a little bit more risk adverse these days

[Alpinum]

I've had SPOT, now InReach for years and only use them for multiple week long trips with many days outside phone signal, where the next road/track is days away.

Hiking/scrambling over ridges in proper poor show weather in Scotland last autumn, solo, with a few days at a time not seeing anybody and irregular phone signal (yet mostly once a day on top of some hill) I didn't bother bringing my InReach.

When bikepacking in the Alps - mostly situations where I take a significant amount of risk and had a fair share of injuries high up, lost friends doing just that, saw friends immobilised up top after a bad crash etc. - I don't use one... weird actually. Despite many sketchy situations hours away from a phone signal - by bike or without.

I go by the regular call in dead lines with my girlfriend when in the Alps.

But lets face it, a hard crash with eg a slightly torn spleen, broken tibia, broken ribs and light brain trauma will be enough to see me dead before any call in deadline is crossed. Hitting a button in such a state will see me through. Been there (no spleen injury - but all the others up a mountain) myself and have experienced friends/fellow riders with serious injuries where time is the decisive factor. Still... no GPS messenger. Darwinism thinking here.
Thankfully, I've always managed to get myself down the mountain and into a hospital. So it seems not every crash ends up killing us.

These circumstances display another reason to use GPS messengers (and for some probably the main reason) - to let loved ones know I'm okay when I'm away for a few weeks.

Another important reason for me to go from an old but still well working 2nd generation SPOT to InReach was 2 way communication. We've covered this in other threads before, just look for InReach or sat comm or so.

GPS messenger/sat comm or not - it's a highly personal and not really rational issue. We can only share experiences and backgrounds on how and why we decide in the given circumstances.

Anybody interested in two 2nd gen SPOTs?