Lightweight shelters

[middleagedmadness]

Soz.. I meant to add https://www.bergzeit.co.uk/sea-to-summi ... OEQAvD_BwE

Not 100% sure but that's got a HH of 1000 and 1200 on the floor ,I've always been under their presumption that you needed a minimum of 1500mm to be classed as waterproof ,I may be wrong here but it could be a expensive water resistant shelter
Edit stu beat me to it while my fat fingers were typing
Edit again - but for once in my life my presumption was correct

[sean_iow]

what do the hardened lot think of this.

I think it's not actually waterproof. It has a rated HH of 1000, material should be 1500 minimum to be considered waterproof ... we're back to the lightweight inner-tube thing again.

If it's got a separate fly does it need to be waterproof? I think our old canvas patrol tents in the scouts weren't waterproof but the water making it though the flysheet ran down the underside of the fly and dripped off? I might be getting this wrong as it was a long time ago

Bur same as the lightweight inner-tube - I wouldn't buy it.

Edit - Just noticed the floor's not waterproof either, so same as the tube, great for carrying, not so great for using

[BigdummySteve]

First it's midgets then it's eastern Europeans! ("without the Poles" )

Ooh, he’s making it up as he goes along. He’ll be having a go at the birds next.

[Bearbonesnorm]

If it's got a separate fly does it need to be waterproof?

Single skin Sean.

[sean_iow]

Single skin Sean.

To be fair, it says this in the description of the materials

20D Nylon, Pertex Endurance (rainfly)

I read "rainfly" and assumed it was a flysheet.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Uhm, hard to know exactly but it doesn't appear to have any kind of inner or separation? I'm also assuming that bloke isn't some kind of giant and the thing is actually tiny.

[sean_iow]

I think you're right that it's single skin, it's just the word "rainfly" which confused me. I was trying to think what to call it on a single skin tent... roof? top? canopy? I can now see why they chose rainfly

[redefined_cycles]

So... whilst BigSteve is still umming and aarring about a Zpaks or a Hyperlite, Ive come to the conclusion... I dont wanna be soft and going for the cuben Borah at 125g and like EscapeGoat did with his bike built around a bag, I'm gonna build my shelter around the bag....

Steve since its your thread, you can have my Goretex bivi bag which is massive abd 950g for a smallest of contribution to Feed the Bear or to Mountain Rescue (whichever is your local or preferred)...

Q is, does the Borah (getting from tge eurpoean shop so wont have option to have them (Borah) modify for me) come with a midge(t) net built in... Is that what its talking bout when it says 'noseeum net'...

[redefined_cycles]

Hopefully that will get everyone off the topic of that rediculous S2S tent I enquired of (my bad... soz)

[Bearbonesnorm]

Q is, does the Borah (getting from tge eurpoean shop so wont have option to have them (Borah) modify for me) come with a midge(t) net built in... Is that what its talking bout when it says 'noseeum net'...

Yes, it has a built-in net. Do remember that Borah bivvy bags (apart from the snowyside) aren't waterproof. The bottoms are but the tops are water resistant at best.

[BigdummySteve]

Steve since its your thread, you can have my Goretex bivi bag which is massive abd 950g for a smallest of contribution to Feed the Bear or to Mountain Rescue (whichever is your local or preferred)..

Cheers, I’d rather boil my nuts in tar. The offer is appreciated though

What do people think of this?

https://www.elitemountainsupplies.co.uk ... lMQAvD_BwE

The inner weighs 210g replacing it with a bathtub floor when not needed could result in a sub 400g shelter that only needs four pegs to erect. Pricey though.....

[Bearbonesnorm]

It's probably a great tent Steve but whether I'm paying £50 or £500, I really want to be able sit up - this is only 70cm high. If I did decide to bite, I'd probably look at the 1p version as I value porch space over sleeping space ... but I am a midget.

[redefined_cycles]

I looked into that Steve previously... its gonna be clostrophobic and probably not that solid. My reading steered me away. The Hyperlight or the zpaks is the way forward with that kind of money

[middleagedmadness]

And also remember the cuben version ,it's only the base that's cuben the actual body is argon 67 which from the feel of mine needs a bit of tlc when in use,I may be wrong but it is very light and thin
Also found I'm glad I ordered a wide version of the borah any less width and I may have found it a bit tight ,Steve I think after this thread there's no perfect answer ,each shelter system has its draw backs it's just which of those your willing to live with ,as I don't like to set up camp early and like to be away early a Bivi bag makes sense for me ,all I want is something to sleep in and I'm normally well on with the drink that I don't notice how comfortable it is or not ,but remember your looking at spending a fair few quid so make sure it's what you know you really want and not what is lot think you want

[whitestone]

As noted some way back in the thread, I've both the Borah Gear cuben fibre and the Borah Gear ultralight bivvies (in fact Cath has an ultralight bivy as well). There's 45g difference between the two, the main difference is the material for the floor: cuben (obviously) and silnylon respectfully. Both models come with a section of noseeum (what the Americans call midges) or midge netting for the neck area upwards but all ours are slightly custom in that the panel of midge netting is more of a letterbox with the actual head end being Argon to provide a bit of protection from spray. The bivvies have a grosjean loop that lets you attach a lifter to keep the netting away from your face.

The material for the upper, a couple of weights of Argon, isn't waterproof so you can't use the bivy on its own. Also with having the netting panel it was never going to be waterproof anyway. The bivy will handle spray and light splatter (fnarr!) so is handy for use under a tarp if it's breezy just to catch any stray moisture.

With Borah now seeming to have a European distributor I'm not sure if John will do direct sales to the UK. Custom stuff is likely but not the standard models. I paid $210 for the two ultralight bivvies. That included shipping but not the £8 Royal Mail release fee. This was Jan 2018. From ordering/paying it was three weeks to him shipping it.

Back to tents I agree with Stu - you want a tent that you can at least sit up in. For most of us that's going to mean a tent with at least 90cm internal height. To me that's a problem with most of the very light tents - they just don't have a lot of space. It's all well and good saying "it weighs XXXg" but if you have to have an advanced diploma in yoga to put your socks on then it's not very usable.

Steve, it sounds to me like you are looking at spending around £500. In that situation my choices would be: the ZPacks Pleximid; MSR Hubba NX; with the Lunar Solo as a budget option. Not surprisingly with those three as the cost comes down the weight goes up.

[pistonbroke]

by BigdummySteve » Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:40 pm

I was just wondering, I’ve an aversion to tarps, changed my rigid forks for boingers and run a 28x42 as my low gear. I did have one if stu’s stickers but it ‘fell’ off.

you don’t think I’ve gone s**t

Please don’t let it be true

Don't worry Steve, I've got a stash of the Stop Being Soft stickers that came with my TNR badge, these will be presented at the end of the C2C Day 3, it's a sort of insurance policy for me to avoid a lynching early on

[redefined_cycles]

Dont suppose (I assume this is what Bob and Reg have) you could do that thing of making an all round shelter with pole towards centre with this http://www.trekkertent.com/home/home/9- ... -tarp.html

If so would the S2S nano mesh work in it aswell or is it more specific to the structire of the Gatewood tarp...

Lookslike that 400 to 500g might not be that hard to achieve afterall without getting the full 120h overtime spent on it!

[benp1]

Not sure on weight, but being tall, I like the tarptent aeon li

[BigdummySteve]

by BigdummySteve » Wed Mar 20, 2019 4:40 pm

I was just wondering, I’ve an aversion to tarps, changed my rigid forks for boingers and run a 28x42 as my low gear. I did have one if stu’s stickers but it ‘fell’ off.

you don’t think I’ve gone s**t

Please don’t let it be true

Don't worry Steve, I've got a stash of the Stop Being Soft stickers that came with my TNR badge, these will be presented at the end of the C2C Day 3, it's a sort of insurance policy for me to avoid a lynching early on

Bit harsh of people getting the hump, the ride starts at sea level which unless your hard of thinking or in Holland implies some uphill.
That said it was Scots comment about the early climbing which led me to look at cutting some heft.

[whitestone]

Dont suppose (I assume this is what Bob and Reg have) you could do that thing of making an all round shelter with pole towards centre with this http://www.trekkertent.com/home/home/9- ... -tarp.html

If so would the S2S nano mesh work in it aswell or is it more specific to the structire of the Gatewood tarp...

Looks like that 400 to 500g might not be that hard to achieve afterall without getting the full 120h overtime spent on it!

The nano mesh is specific to the shape of the Gatewood and similar shaped tarps. Putting a pole in the centre of a flat tarp like the Trekkertent will leave folds of material flapping around and potentially pushing and flapping against the inner.

[middleagedmadness]

Cmon then Steve put us out of our misery what ya going for buddy

[redefined_cycles]

Surely he's gone the Zpaks way..

What I've gone with, based on info from here this thread and my pocket money...

Borah bivi m90 (thanks to a bear)
DD Hammocks this https://www.worldbackpacker.co.uk/dd-ha ... tent-p7075 which can fit 2 and possibly work with that nano mesh
Pole from Stu which I'm having made to fit all three options

Then when money can afford, zpaks plexamid and in between that time (when money is able) a cuben tarp from Trekker...

[redefined_cycles]

Thats the 14 month projection 2

[BigdummySteve]

Cmon then Steve put us out of our misery what ya going for buddy

Well......first I need to find out exactly how much overtime I get paid. Due to my own incompetence I didn’t submit 60+ hours in time last month!

But I’m leaning towards the plexamid or the zpacks tarp, it’s a head scratcher. My telemark is under 600g without inner including pole, obviously I’d need to include a groundsheet and it’s a bigger? Size. But with potentially 10 pegs needed for the Plex you have to take that into account. I use four titanium nail pegs for my tele supplemented with some of the tiny shepherds crook ti pegs to pin it down if a blow is forecast.

While the plex is tempting at possibly 500g including one of stu’s poles do I gain much apart from perhaps 150g saved and more trail cred for having a proper bikepacking shelter?

To be honest I think the £500 It might cost me could possibly be better spent, for instance if I replaced the sram xx1 cassette I broke I’d save the same at half the cost...when you’ve got to a low base weight you enter a spiral of diminishing returns. As another example a cumulus 150 is 380g v 475g for my Rab mythic 200, the rab has been used all winter.

If I grow a pair (free) the tarp option however could save not only the shelter weight but possibly also I could loose the front bag all together.
Weighing options (pun intended) ......

[Bearbonesnorm]

Aye, this lad uses a tarp all year round