Lightweight shelters

[middleagedmadness]

Cmon then Steve put us out of our misery what ya going for buddy

Well......first I need to find out exactly how much overtime I get paid. Due to my own incompetence I didn’t submit 60+ hours in time last month!

But I’m leaning towards the plexamid or the zpacks tarp, it’s a head scratcher. My telemark is under 600g without inner including pole, obviously I’d need to include a groundsheet and it’s a bigger? Size. But with potentially 10 pegs needed for the Plex you have to take that into account. I use four titanium nail pegs for my tele supplemented with some of the tiny shepherds crook ti pegs to pin it down if a blow is forecast.

While the plex is tempting at possibly 500g including one of stu’s poles do I gain much apart from perhaps 150g saved and more trail cred for having a proper bikepacking shelter?

To be honest I think the £500 It might cost me could possibly be better spent, for instance if I replaced the sram xx1 cassette I broke I’d save the same at half the cost...when you’ve got to a low base weight you enter a spiral of diminishing returns. As another example a cumulus 150 is 380g v 475g for my Rab mythic 200, the rab has been used all winter.

If I grow a pair (free) the tarp option however could save not only the shelter weight but possibly also I could loose the front bag all together.
Weighing options (pun intended) ......

If your Telemark is that low weight without the inner just get some permavent off stu or some polycro for your ground sheet literally weighs f- all ,no point spending for sake of spending mate

[Lazarus]

Agree with that and my conclusion from this is
1) if you want really lightweight/the lightest go bivvy /tarp and use your bike
2) lightweight tent combinations with inners are very spendy

Mine is from ali express [though bought from here] and is under 600g for an inner and an outer tent [ without poles or pegs] and 300g with just outer [ at £35-£50 cost for both new ]. Its about 1.75 people wide and you can sit up in it

I cannot see me spending £400-£600 to save 100 g and bivvies are ok for over nghters but not going to spend to save grams and the cheap bivvy options offer no weight saving.

I would get the stu advised cape and the bug net due to weight at price its 600g with the proper full inner and bathtub iirc]

[mechanicaldope]

So, how does the Cape and net combo work in difficult to pitch spots? It's been said before that there are times you can pitch a tarp but cant pitch a tent (sniggers). How does this apply to the Cape?

[Bearbonesnorm]

Cape will pitch anywhere like a tarp will. The Nano net that I use has no base (although you can seal it around a mat), so no different to just using a tarp, bivvy bag, etc.

[whitestone]

Lazarus - +1. It seems that once you get below somewhere around the 800g range (maybe a bit lower) then prices start to get silly especially if you want a fully enclosed space. A cuben fibre tarp and a lightweight bivy like one of the Borah models will get you to 400g or so and is more flexible than a tent.

The Gatewood is probably halfway between tarp and tent, certainly if you use the SMD inner it's much like a tent but the tarp only setup just needs the ground space.

[Lazarus]

regarding the nano net what is it like to get out of in the dark when you answer a call of nature ?

Is it tucked in under your mat [ so a pain] or just resting on he floor so easy to move to get out [ my tent is similar enough it would work and i like the weight and price.
Will give me an inner and outer and poles and pegs at 450 g[and costs just over £100 to do]
Please say its midge proof

[RIP]

So, if everyone gets what they've said they're gonna get, we can reconvene here in a few weeks and have a Grand Weigh Off. It'll be like the fat fighters thread but for shelters .

edit: any boring Rules? I'd like to offer that you must be able to get changed for/after night without getting rained on or it's not really a 'shelter'. Can't think of any others - fatuous or otherwise .

[redefined_cycles]

So, if everyone gets what they've said they're gonna get, we can reconvene here in a few weeks and have a Grand Weigh Off. It'll be like the fat fighters thread but for shelters .

edit: any boring Rules? I'd like to offer that you must be able to get changed for/after night without getting rained on or it's not really a 'shelter'. Can't think of any others - fatuous or otherwise .

But then what'd you call the thread...

FatShelter Fighters Weigh in Thread

[Bearbonesnorm]

Is it tucked in under your mat [ so a pain] or just resting on he floor so easy to move to get out [ my tent is similar enough it would work and i like the weight and price.

It has pegging points and an draw-corded elastic around the edge but you don't have to use either. It's tall enough that you can fit it and have a good few inches of surplus around the bottom resting on the floor. Getting out is then simply a matter of lifting it up.

It is midge proof

[Lazarus]

cheers- I shall give i a go.

[mechanicaldope]

So, what are the disadvantages to the Cape system then? Was thinking about a luna solo but really beginning to be swayed. I assume that no bivi bag would be needed, especially with the full serenity inner. Assume you can also leave it open to see the stars if weather is fine. There must be some drawbacks?

[redefined_cycles]

Not as light as an equivalent priced trekkertent cuben tarp...

Gatewood circa 300g at around £150
Cuben from trekkertent between 125g at 225g (largest) at equivalent price!!

[mechanicaldope]

Yeah, but that's "just" a tarp.

[redefined_cycles]

Yeah, but that's "just" a tarp.

Yup put that on the 'advantages' list for the Gatewood

[Lazarus]

What is the difference between a lightweight shelter/tent and a tarp - shape basically.
IMHO cheap tents are just a tarp ,with only one pitching shape, that makes what we recognize to be a tent shape- which is also what the cape does.

[Bearbonesnorm]

So, what are the disadvantages to the Cape system then?

Not sure you can really describe the Gatewood Cape as a 'system'. In reality it's just a shaped tarp in the same way that a Trailstar or Lair is - it just happens to be a very good shape IMO. Stick a fully fitted net inside and you've created a tent and I'm not sure that offers an great advantage over a Lunar solo.

[whitestone]

It might be fair to describe the Gatewood as "modular" in that you don't need to use all the parts all of the time. On its own it's a shaped tarp. With the Serenity inner it's a tent. Some of the semi-freestanding tents like the MSR Hubba series and the Big Agnes Copper Spur come at this from the other way: they are primarily tents but you can pitch them just using the groundsheet to get a shaped tarp.

The Trekkertent tarp is a plain flat tarp, it's up to you to decide how to "shape" and pitch it. That's both a strength and a weakness depending on your point of view. A shaped tarp is sort of halfway to a tent in that the designer has said: "Here's a predefined shape, you just need to peg it out add a pole (or poles)". Again there are advantages and disadvantages: it's easy to pitch because there's only one way to do it but you now need a space big enough, the right shape and the right orientation to use it.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Has anyone else ever being surprised by how stupid midges can be? On a few occasions, I've pitched up only to then be attacked by the winged teeth but due to whatever reason decided to stay put and get on with it. However, upon entering my shelter (sorry, only seems to work with something offering full coverage), they've not managed to work out how to find their way underneath the edge and inside ... I'm not talking full tent or something with an inner.

[whitestone]

Don't they follow the trail of CO2 and other gases you exhale? That's presumably warmer than the surrounding air so will rise so they'll try and get to you via that elevated route.

[RIP]

Bit irrelevant now that r_c has made his mind up ( for the moment ) but I said I'd pop back with new pole, so:

pole 48g
tarp including lots of lines 249g
shower curtain 20g
10 v-pegs 90g
total shelter: 407g. worked fine in 50mph wind and rain. 6 pegs fine normally = 367g

wide tyvek 78g
exped hlite mat 360g
pillowpump 145g (schnoz + hlite pillow 40g lighter but prefer the p'pump)
midge net 20g
down hat 45g
2 season bag 395g
4 season bag 790g
total sleepkit: 1043g or 1438g

two 8L barbags with straps 108g x 2

total 1666g or 2061g on bars.

[redefined_cycles]

Reg.. I am indeed decided on the Lunar Solo (for now ) and have even ordered my medium to semi (apparently he only did the ultralight one for you cos you're special with special kit) light pole. Its hoping to arrive early next week even

Obviously I'll be using it without the innards and just stay away from sugar during the midge season (in my opinion and exp it works)...

Reg... why not put your kit list copy in the PackedBikes weigh in Thread

[Bearbonesnorm]

Obviously I'll be using it without the innards

It doesn't have a removeable inner. It's a tent / tarp hybrid and the inner is formed by mesh sewn to the outer and groundsheet.

[RIP]

Your pole will be (more than) fine Shaf. I think I'd regard mine as 'experimental' rather than special. One of the many benefits of Stu's gear is that he may be able to try one-offs (MaM's stove might be another example) which for his own reasons he may not wish to drop onto the main production line quite just yet or at all. Maybe this one has an as yet undiscovered propensity to bend when in close proximity to Welsh sheep, hence the experiment .

[Bearbonesnorm]

MaM's stove might be another example

That obviously needs to be supplied with an operator

[middleagedmadness]

MaM's stove might be another example

That obviously needs to be supplied with an operator

Yep the operator is a bit gung ho and thick ,but to my defense I was still full of drink and woken at 5am by what sounded like a banshee wailing on the chase and it wasn't mart leaving ,never known anyone pack up so quietly and just tip off into the dawn