Another reason not to have a fire

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JohnClimber
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Another reason not to have a fire

Post by JohnClimber »

Just reading a very good book.
Wild Camping by Stephen Neale
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wild-Camping-E ... phen+Neale

A couple of interesting things that he brings up is that
"Wild camping is not illegal.
It used to be, back in the 1930's.
But this was decriminalised by Section 4 of the Vagrancy Act 1938."

And
"There are several differences between criminal and civil law. Trespass is civil law and not a crime. No one can be prosecuted for trespass"
"Although the act of trespass is actionable in (a civil) court, the landowner will only be granted nominal damages of a few pounds if there is no loss or damage"

Shortening the next section..... if you damage the land in any way this is now a criminal offence and actionable in crown courts. So leave no trace...... and avoid fires.

A great book to add to your list
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Richard G
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by Richard G »

I wonder how "damage" is defined. I mean, digging a cat hole is technically damaging the land... so I wonder if that would count.
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Bearbonesnorm
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by Bearbonesnorm »

I wonder how "damage" is defined
I imagine something visual would do the trick. It really is very difficult to have a fire and leave no trace ... covering the remains over with leaves doesn't really cut it.
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JohnClimber
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by JohnClimber »

No damage and leave no trace means just that.

Cutting into the earth damages it, if you are found with the land damaged (before you put it all back once finished) then this is criminal damage and the police can and may be called.

Take a jacket and if asked to leave do so without an argument, then you are doing nothing "criminally" wrong just causing a "civil" disturbance...... I guess #NotALawyer
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RIP
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by RIP »

If you have a fire, unless you've packed it in you've presumably stolen the wood as well, whatever state it might be in....

Another useful thread this one, re "issues" of legality when defending one's "state of bivi".

Presumably you can enter a building and "squat" there so long as you don't break in? In our case "a building" obviously varies from "just the foundations left" to "penthouse flat".

I wonder if you can steal water?!
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Bearbonesnorm
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by Bearbonesnorm »

I wonder if you can steal water?!
I have a feeling that water in rivers etc belongs to the crown ... you can own 'the river' but you don't own the water in it.
May the bridges you burn light your way
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RIP
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by RIP »

"belongs to the crown" - interesting. Breaking the law is one thing, but, gulp, stealing from Her Maj? I can see a long queue of 'boners awaiting their turn at the Tower Of London :smile:.
"My God, Ponsonby, I'm two-thirds of the way to the grave and what have I done?" - RIP

The sign outside the asylum is the wrong way round.....

"At least you got some stories" - James Acaster
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whitestone
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by whitestone »

Bearbonesnorm wrote:
I wonder if you can steal water?!
I have a feeling that water in rivers etc belongs to the crown ... you can own 'the river' but you don't own the water in it.
Might want to ask United Utilities about that :roll:
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Mike
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by Mike »

I left a massive skid on some grass the other day?
jam bo
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by jam bo »

whitestone wrote:
Bearbonesnorm wrote:
I wonder if you can steal water?!
I have a feeling that water in rivers etc belongs to the crown ... you can own 'the river' but you don't own the water in it.
Might want to ask United Utilities about that :roll:
they will have an extraction licence.

there are long running arguments in the kayaking world about access rights and rights of navigation etc. it's greyer than grey and in most places people just get on with it.

When was the last time someone got prosecuted for trespass?
ScotRoutes
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by ScotRoutes »

Is it about now that I get to point and laugh at all those folk south of the border? :wink:
jameso
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Re: Another reason not to have a fire

Post by jameso »

ScotRoutes wrote:Is it about now that I get to point and laugh at all those folk south of the border? :wink:
Yes, again.. :grin: but
When was the last time someone got prosecuted for trespass?
. ie I'm not sure it makes any difference to my riding anyway. Of course I'd prefer the rest of the UK to take the more enlightened view on access that Scotland has, but even if they did I'd still have to contend with grumps on the trails - access is little to do with it, it's just the south east isn't it :grin:
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