Uk Divide Route?

[JezS]

Crawley to Guildford

Once you're North of Gatwick (Reigate) - there are plenty of good routes running West along the North Downs...and I can share a good route from Reigate Hill to Shere but I don't know that first bit at all I'm afraid

An alternative would be to pick up the Downs Link around Horsham and take it North to Guildford

Guildford to Reading

From Guildford, the Wey Navigation towpath (part river/part canal) takes you North nicely to Weybridge. From here you can Pick up the Sustrans Thames Valley route to Reading - some of which is on the Thames towpath.

But... a.) that's 2 sides of a square rather than a direct route and b.) following 2 rivers kind of goes against the whole "divide" idea

To my knowledge, Swinley Forest itself no longer requires permits - however, much of the land around there is Army land. There are loads of great trails and XC racing in that area - however, the XC racing is organised by a group called Gorrick in partnership with the Army Cycling Union so I think they get preferential access to private land as a result.

[ctznsmith]

From here you can Pick up the Sustrans Thames Valley route to Reading - some of which is on the Thames towpath.

A lot of that may be 'traffic free' but not much of it is actually 'off road' in a gravel/mtb way.

[ianfitz]

Great to see a load of suggestions for the route so far. Especially as I'm a totally 'south-blind' northerner and have no idea about anything south of Nottingham (apart from Devon and Cornwall!)

Just to revisit the original plan, or maybe look for some agreement for what the route is about so we can more easily work out route options. I started doing some reading about the other 'watersheders' wow can of worms. Seems like no one can agree where either end of it is. At least the middle section is obvious!

Are we prioritising quality over proximity? Should the route make use of existing ITTs or seek new ground. Also what type of off-road experience are we seeking.

Maybe I'm over thinking it but strikes me that having some shared parameters is a good start to a complex project

[whitestone]

Firstly I think that we'd need to settle on a start and end point - technically I suppose the two points should be the junctions between the North Sea and the Atlantic. The northern one is Dunnet Head, the southern is Leathercote Point https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Sea.

From that I'd mark out the closest BW, road or other right of way before determining if it's actually a nice route. It would be nice if it used different trails to existing ITTs but then if those are the best line then they should be used.

[Catbaiter]

Firstly I think that we'd need to settle on a start and end point - technically I suppose the two points should be the junctions between the North Sea and the Atlantic. The northern one is Dunnet Head, the southern is Leathercote Point https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Sea.

From that I'd mark out the closest BW, road or other right of way before determining if it's actually a nice route. It would be nice if it used different trails to existing ITTs but then if those are the best line then they should be used.

Agreed entirely. Though I think the answer the proximity/quality question is going to end up being a judgement call as the route progresses, rather than a blanket rule.

[ianfitz]

Excellent.

I have been doing a bit of gpx doodling, Scotland based, this lunchtime. There's quite a nice looking route from the base of glen golly to dunnet head on forest, estate and back roads, I'm guessing that that part of the world could be a bit heavy going off tracks! It looks pretty sensible.

https://ridewithgps.com/trips/8156720

I also made this, highly speculative, option from Fort Bill (although I realise the route may not go through FW) this is much less certain, and although there are tracks visible for pretty much all of this (on google sat. images) I'm guessing there would be considerable HaB and some long carries on bits of this... I've been very few places here and it could be utterly, utterly horrendous! has anyone been to anywhere on this?

https://ridewithgps.com/trips/8156766

In summary Glen Cona, Glen Finnan, Glen Kingie, Glen Quoich, Clunie Inn, north to Glen Affric, up past the Falls of Glomach, down to Loch Monar, round to Strathcarron, reverse HT550 route through fisherfield (ish), although there does like a possible shorter route past loch fannich - with a bit of HaB, though to oykel bridge via knockdampf, cut accross to the north of Loch Shin, then up to west merkland... Hmmm, who do we know who likes rough ground? Stu - is your knee recovered yet...

[benp1]

I have nothing to add apart from 'good work!'

It's a cracking idea

[Andy_B]

I've been watching this idea develop over the last few days, and it looks like it could be great! I'm based in Canterbury, so if we can reach some sort of a decision on the start/finish point down in Kent, I'm happy to start scouting out a trails.

[Ian]

I know we haven't actually got a route yet, but to help provide a bit of focus for all concerned, I wondered if we should set a date for the Group Start?

[ianfitz]

I've been watching this idea develop over the last few days, and it looks like it could be great! I'm based in Canterbury, so if we can reach some sort of a decision on the start/finish point down in Kent, I'm happy to start scouting out a trails.

The divide between the Chanel and the north sea is Leathercote Point, which doesn't seem to be marked on OS maps! The spot I think it is called Hope point on the one I can see online... Just by the most southerly fairway at Walmer and Kingsdown golf club (as seen on google sat images!)

I'm guessing that the golf club wouldn't welcome an MTB route starting on their land (may be wrong but...) so how about starting at the Dover Patrol Memorial (that is also listed as being at Leathercote Point) its a big and obvious land mark and not too far to get on to some field BWs which head due north towards Kings down/ringwood. That means that although the route wouldn't start bang on the watershed it would certainly cross it in the first few miles...

[ianfitz]

I know we haven't actually got a route yet, but to help provide a bit of focus for all concerned, I wondered if we should set a date for the Group Start?

Next year some time? What would be the best time of year? late June when the days are longest? its going to be loooong. even a very simple straightish line following the watershed is 1500km, its likely to be close to 2500 all in, and a lot of ascent too...

[whitestone]

I know we haven't actually got a route yet, but to help provide a bit of focus for all concerned, I wondered if we should set a date for the Group Start?

Next year some time? What would be the best time of year? late June when the days are longest? its going to be loooong. even a very simple straightish line following the watershed is 1500km, its likely to be close to 2500 all in, and a lot of ascent too...

End of June is probably the YD300, certainly Stuart has used the last weekend in June for both last year's and this. The spring bank holiday week at the end of May? But that would clash with the HT550.

This ITT calender is getting crowded

[Catbaiter]

I know we haven't actually got a route yet, but to help provide a bit of focus for all concerned, I wondered if we should set a date for the Group Start?

Next year some time? What would be the best time of year? late June when the days are longest? its going to be loooong. even a very simple straightish line following the watershed is 1500km, its likely to be close to 2500 all in, and a lot of ascent too...

My plan is to start in May 2017 and see how far I get in 3 weeks. Though I confess that's just a plan at present.

[Catbaiter]

Excellent.

I have been doing a bit of gpx doodling, Scotland based, this lunchtime. There's quite a nice looking route from the base of glen golly to dunnet head on forest, estate and back roads, I'm guessing that that part of the world could be a bit heavy going off tracks! It looks pretty sensible.

https://ridewithgps.com/trips/8156720

I also made this, highly speculative, option from Fort Bill (although I realise the route may not go through FW) this is much less certain, and although there are tracks visible for pretty much all of this (on google sat. images) I'm guessing there would be considerable HaB and some long carries on bits of this... I've been very few places here and it could be utterly, utterly horrendous! has anyone been to anywhere on this?

https://ridewithgps.com/trips/8156766

In summary Glen Cona, Glen Finnan, Glen Kingie, Glen Quoich, Clunie Inn, north to Glen Affric, up past the Falls of Glomach, down to Loch Monar, round to Strathcarron, reverse HT550 route through fisherfield (ish), although there does like a possible shorter route past loch fannich - with a bit of HaB, though to oykel bridge via knockdampf, cut accross to the north of Loch Shin, then up to west merkland... Hmmm, who do we know who likes rough ground? Stu - is your knee recovered yet...

Nice work!

[ianfitz]

I also got in touch with Peter, the ribbon of wildness guy, he has passed on my contact details to Eslbeth who ran the scotish watershed in one push recently, I'm told she has GPX tracks of her route, which may be useful. I'm pretty sure an MTB route wouldn't want to follow them in its entirity but at least it will show us where it goes very accurately!

[ianfitz]

a bit more google-foo during a late lunch today revealed this - http://www.bikely.com/maps/bike-path/Gl ... Cape-Wrath

and a blog with photos and description http://bigplansweecountry.blogspot.co.u ... rough.html

[ianfitz]

I also got in touch with Peter, the ribbon of wildness guy, he has passed on my contact details to Eslbeth who ran the scotish watershed in one push recently, I'm told she has GPX tracks of her route, which may be useful. I'm pretty sure an MTB route wouldn't want to follow them in its entirity but at least it will show us where it goes very accurately!

peter sent me this link - http://maps.nls.uk/view/74401061 a useful zoomable map of scotland watershed. From this it does look like we will have to go onwards to duncansby head though...

[firedfromthecircus]

I have nothing to add apart from 'good work!'

It's a cracking idea

+1

[Ray Young]

Been following this with interest. My opinion is only follow it so long as it serves it's purpose, use it as a guide rather than a hard set rule. Some great riding off line, go for it. A crap loop, miss it out, the routes going to be long enough anyway. You want a route that generally does what it says but also gives people a good chance of finishing it.
I can supply a route from the North end of The Yorkshire Dales up to Hadrians Wall or possibly further if need be. Will get back on that.

[Catbaiter]

Amazing response from everyone.

So, to summarise we have the following 'rules'

1. The start and end must be the watershed (within legal and accessible reason)
2. The route should use the watershed as a guide, but not at the expense of poor riding or missing an absolute gem (this rule is kind of vague, but it allows for artistic creativity)
3. The route must be off-road wherever possible
4. If possible the route should avoid large population centres. No-one wants to ride through Coventry... Even on a canal path.

In terms of route setting.

1. We have a good idea of the general route
2. We have start and end points
3. Scotland is coming along nicely, and it looks like we can fairly easily get from the border to derby (especially using the Pennine Bridleway)
4. The S and SE looks tricky all the way to Calne (though not impossible) the South Downs Way is still an option to make a lot of it easier to follow and accomplish. Does anyone have any thoughts? Do we take the South Downs, of find a route through the Weald?
5. Calne to Stroud(ish) we have a route (Fosse Way).
6. The dreaded Avon Loop, from Cheltenham(ish) to Wolverhampton(ish) via Coventry(ish). Do we do it?
7. We have a pretty big gap between Stroud and Derby (see point 6).

Not bad going for a weeks work and given that we have a year to refine it!

[ctznsmith]

Following the Avon loop pushes you away from Birmingham doesn't it? Which is good for avoiding urban areas.

If you ignore the Avon loop you can get from Derby to near Tamworth (and on to Birmingham if you so wish) via a pretty rough/bumpy canal path (Trent and Mersey? - I can dig out the GPX track if interested). Then you would have to drop south somehow between Coventry/Birmingham and head across Warwickshire and the Cotswolds to Stroud.

[Andy_B]

4. The S and SE looks tricky all the way to Calne (though not impossible) the South Downs Way is still an option to make a lot of it easier to follow and accomplish. Does anyone have any thoughts? Do we take the South Downs, of find a route through the Weald?

I'm looking at this at the moment and staring intently at my maps in the hope that more bridleways/byways/trails may appear, but no luck yet. The North Downs Way is primarily a footpath, although there are some bits that are bridle/byway. Getting away from Leathercote Point (the Memorial) is proving particularly difficult. There are a few routes that go North/South, but not much East/West. I've put a first idea together, and I have some bits to add to take it to the south-west of Canterbury.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/12633011 ... Oi1erYgCkv

I'll try and get out over the next week or 2 and see if this works and if I spot any more good sections I could add.

The South Downs way would be great, we then just have to get from Leathercote Point to Eastbourne. Happy to explore this option too.

[Catbaiter]

Following the Avon loop pushes you away from Birmingham doesn't it? Which is good for avoiding urban areas.

If you ignore the Avon loop you can get from Derby to near Tamworth (and on to Birmingham if you so wish) via a pretty rough/bumpy canal path (Trent and Mersey? - I can dig out the GPX track if interested). Then you would have to drop south somehow between Coventry/Birmingham and head across Warwickshire and the Cotswolds to Stroud.

Good stuff. I've been looking at that section and scratching my head a little. If you could share the GPX that would be great thanks.

[Catbaiter]

4. The S and SE looks tricky all the way to Calne (though not impossible) the South Downs Way is still an option to make a lot of it easier to follow and accomplish. Does anyone have any thoughts? Do we take the South Downs, of find a route through the Weald?

I'm looking at this at the moment and staring intently at my maps in the hope that more bridleways/byways/trails may appear, but no luck yet. The North Downs Way is primarily a footpath, although there are some bits that are bridle/byway. Getting away from Leathercote Point (the Memorial) is proving particularly difficult. There are a few routes that go North/South, but not much East/West. I've put a first idea together, and I have some bits to add to take it to the south-west of Canterbury.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/12633011 ... Oi1erYgCkv

I'll try and get out over the next week or 2 and see if this works and if I spot any more good sections I could add.

The South Downs way would be great, we then just have to get from Leathercote Point to Eastbourne. Happy to explore this option too.

I started out from the memorial and found myself being steered inexorably north too. There's very little east/west action to be had. Still, the last hundred miles or so of the GDMBT is on road, and it finishes a long way from the geographic divide too!

Anything you can do to scout a workable route would be amazing, thanks.

[ScotRoutes]

I also made this, highly speculative, option from Fort Bill (although I realise the route may not go through FW) this is much less certain, and although there are tracks visible for pretty much all of this (on google sat. images) I'm guessing there would be considerable HaB and some long carries on bits of this... I've been very few places here and it could be utterly, utterly horrendous! has anyone been to anywhere on this?

https://ridewithgps.com/trips/8156766

In summary Glen Cona, Glen Finnan, Glen Kingie, Glen Quoich, Clunie Inn, north to Glen Affric, up past the Falls of Glomach, down to Loch Monar, round to Strathcarron, reverse HT550 route through fisherfield (ish), although there does like a possible shorter route past loch fannich - with a bit of HaB, though to oykel bridge via knockdampf, cut accross to the north of Loch Shin, then up to west merkland... Hmmm, who do we know who likes rough ground? Stu - is your knee recovered yet...

there would be considerable HaB and some long carries on bits of this could be a bit of an understatement. For a start, there's no track heading from Pait Lodge to Loch Calavie, despite what the OS might say It would be a boggy, peaty, tussocky carry to around Loch an Tachdaidh.