I'm just on the last stages of Project Fargo and getting things dialled in just right.
The frame is an XL which looks at the bottom of the height range for and the fork is uncut. This gives me the option of setting the bar height equal to the saddle.
Should I take that option? All my other bikes have significant drop. My Krampus has least but still feels like it's level when I ride.
Apart from comfort on the positive side and wind resistance on the negative side what do folks think are the pro's and con's for high bars on a bike for fast (relative) long duration ITT type rides.
Thanks

My fargo rode best with the drops section of woodchippers level with the saddle. I found the drops the primary hand position and the bike was really comfy this way for all day riding, and also made the bike very capable doing off road descents. This was a lot higher than any other drop bar bike I have ridden! Personal choice is of course key. Guitar Ted has some good blog posts on this, worth reading.

The closest thing I have to a Fargo is my Amazon.

It's set up like this


DSC_0143 by Colin Cadden - Flickr2BBcode


So, there's a slight drop to the bar. I ride in the drops frequently, especially on rough terrain, but like having the bar low enough that I'm leaning into it even when riding on the hoods.

Spacers, lots of spacers...

Leave the steerer uncut for now and just set things up with your best guess.
Yes it will look ugly, but as you ride you can have a play around with what works/doesn't as it's mainly due to personal preference.

If it's a new type of bike this could take 6 months of riding to find what works.

You can cut it down later once you're happy. Harder to add it back on at a later date.

Yeah what Chew says . Fargo is quite different bike to the road bike pictured above

Yes it will look ugly,

The good thing is that once set-up, it'll still look ugly ... but you'll have had 6 months to get used to it

I bought a cheap 95mm adjustable stem from the lbs to try various set ups to see what spec fixed stem I needed. Brilliant idea until I found that nobody makes a stem of that spec so still got the adjustable fitted. The bars are in the ‘classic’ Fargo raised position set higher than the saddle but that is because I am old and not as bendy as I used to be.
If you have troll through the mbr Fargo thread there are lots of pictures with different set ups.

P1170908 (1024x576) by michaelandamanda, on Flickr

Mariner wrote:Brilliant idea until I found that nobody makes a stem of that spec so still got the adjustable fitted.

Cinelli do a stem with a 35deg rise* that looks similar to that position, called the Pista. Cheap too.

*If you fit it upside down.

pro's and con's for high bars on a bike for fast (relative) long duration ITT type rides.

Pros - well, I've never wanted my bars to be lower a few days or more into a long ride, racing or not. Power output is about comfort and stability and I don't see much to suggest a low bar position aiding that, it's mostly useful in fairly short stints on racier types of bike.

Cons - most bikes don't corner so well with very high bars but that's about it. You might catch a bit more wind resistance, nothing I'd be bothered about though, not with bags on the bike, etc.

Generally I get my saddle positioned so my weight isn't tipping me forward onto my hands, then set the bars as high as I can w/o losing the front wheel in corners by being too far above the contact patch. Fair to say I think most bikes have front ends that are too low, mainly because of fashion/aesthetics and riders not generally spending long periods on them, or at least not that often.

Oli.vert wrote:

Mariner wrote:Brilliant idea until I found that nobody makes a stem of that spec so still got the adjustable fitted.

Cinelli do a stem with a 35deg rise* that looks similar to that position, called the Pista. Cheap too.

*If you fit it upside down.

Yeh I have that upside down on my Genesis Vapour CX that's set up for 'gravel'. It's been fine on trips over rough stuff with a bar harness, tri-bars, bottle and stems cells on the bars.

Slightly below level...but I tend to ride on the hoods unless its pretty steep.

Dont know if this helps?
Just found it while looking for something else.
http://yojimg.net/bike/web_tools/stem.php

I just spent a whole lot of time looking at images of Fargo's and it would appear that bars level with the saddle is the done thing.
I'll give it a try. It does look double ugly at the moment but I'm sure I'll get used to it. It'll probably look better with some bags on. The35mm tyres probably don't help but they're not staying.
Should be built this weekend and off for a ride Monday

fargo with drops

cidImage_FOTB2FA.JPG by 20ston, on Flickr

fargo with jones loops

cidImage_FOT21B9.JPG by 20ston, on Flickr

Interesting you have gone with a straight seatpost rather than a setback post?
Only ask because after trawling through hundreds of photos a setback appears to be 'standard' build when a Thudbuster is not fitted.
Hoping to try a straight one but having plumb-lined my knee/pedal position I think I will have to stick with the setback.
Basically just trying to get closer to the bars.

Have you managed to ride it with Jones Loops if so what is the handling like?

wriggles wrote:My fargo rode best with the drops section of woodchippers level with the saddle. I found the drops the primary hand position and the bike was really comfy this way for all day riding, and also made the bike very capable doing off road descents.

Snap woodchippers are not your average drop bar, mine are set with the ‘hook’ of the drop at seat height and at an angle of about 20deg downwards. The tip of the bar just clears the top tube. I liked mine so much I upgraded to the carbon version

Bars as high as possible - least strain on back, neck and wrists, best control downhill, b*gger all effect on wind resistance.
Ergotec high charisma stems go well on a fargo

Beware, no drop bar related content;

All 'regular' bikes I have, have a roughly similar saddle-bar height difference and also overall height.
For comfort I just go a tiny little bit shorter on the length, speak stem length and saddle position.
The steering will be more direct, which works well with flat head angles, but have no clue how it translates to a Fargo.
Perhaps worth a try?

Snap woodchippers are not your average drop bar,

very much this. I tried them on my gravel bike positioned much lower and much preferred Cowchippers. Think woodchippers really work well on a fargo set at the right hieght. Only bar similar is the Dajia Farbar I think

Hoping to try a straight one but having plumb-lined my knee/pedal position I think I will have to stick with the setback.
Basically just trying to get closer to the bars.

Without wanting to be an online fit adviser (can't be done), I do wonder if any fitter that starts with a plumb line from the knee should stop there and pack up so don't worry too much about that as a fitting guide. It may be a convenient way to get to a starting place on a 73-73 square frame road bike of old but not a Fargo or other bike that's been designed for a non road race riding position.

Point's been covered before I think but worth saying: one problem with using an inline post to get closer to the bar, thinking the shorter position will be comfier, is that you've just shifted your C of G (approx where your belly button is) forward over the BB so you'll need more core strength or pedal force to counteract that body weight balance and you'll feel more weight on your hands - probably the opposite of what you're trying to achieve. What many riders find is that by moving the saddle back they get into overall balance and then the reach to the bar is far less vital. On my all-road bike my saddle is in the right place and I can move my bars fore-aft +/-20mm or up/down with practically zero effect on long distance comfort, despite brands seeing under 10mm of reach or 15mm stack as a full frame size gap on most road/gravel bikes. With my C of G in the right place I can then move my hand position around quite freely.

ie / in short, if your bars aren't low and you ignore Knee Over Pedal you can rotate your whole body back around the BB and get very comfortable. Putting your knees too far behind the BB can cause issues yes, but there's maybe 20mm (I'm guessing, a bit anyway) either way there to play with which translates to a fair bit of saddle position or seat tube angle.

^^^^^^^
plus with a set back seatpost I cant hang off the back of the saddle (on a drop bar bike ) as I cant reach the brakes.
With a straight seatpost I get a gel pad enema if I don't get out the saddle in time on rough bits.

(Now I have started the sell Fargo buy Stooge debate again.)

if the 15mm or so of post setback is the difference between getting off the back of the saddle or not? From the drops it's a bit of a stretch for most of us I guess. But it's not a great position to be in anyway (unless the drops are set short and quite/very high .. and that's the topic I guess isn't it!)

jameso wrote: if the 15mm or so of post setback is the difference between getting off the back of the saddle or not? From the drops it's a bit of a stretch for most of us I guess. But it's not a great position to be in anyway (unless the drops are set short and quite/very high .. and that's the topic I guess isn't it!)

Nail head.

Mariner wrote: With a straight seatpost I get a gel pad enema if I don't get out the saddle in time on rough bits.

(Now I have started the sell Fargo buy Stooge debate again.)

I’ve just fitted an eesilk post to the Fargo, it’s a short travel ultralight thudbuster, at 50g more than a Thompson elite it’s not a heavyweight, the 20mm of travel might not sound much but makes a big difference to comfort

BigdummySteve wrote:

Mariner wrote: With a straight seatpost I get a gel pad enema if I don't get out the saddle in time on rough bits.

(Now I have started the sell Fargo buy Stooge debate again.)

I’ve just fitted an eesilk post to the Fargo, it’s a short travel ultralight thudbuster, at 50g more than a Thompson elite it’s not a heavyweight, the 20mm of travel might not sound much but makes a big difference to comfort

How much Think I will just stop being soft and dice with the gel pad enema

It was a Christmas present, from me to me I’m worth it