Talk to me about Rohloff

[Dave Barter]

I'm getting more tempted by the day especially after last weekend when a massive clag lump nearly did for my rear mech.

Being a geared hub noob, how does a rohloff compare to a 32x46 setup which I have at the moment? Do they survive massive water dunkings and can an idiot (guess who) look after one. Which model would I look at for my 29'r?

[Bearbonesnorm]

Talk to me about Rohloff

I'll admit to liking some of his pictures and of course, tie my Kangaroo down is something of a classic.

[Dave Barter]

There's always one. Is it the bad back meds?

[burty]

he is in prison , possibly has his soap on a rope .
can you tell what it is yet

[fatbikephil]

I went through a similar thought process last year (no kangaroos were harmed) for the Jones. It turned out that boost rohloffs were only available to special order and SJS wanted my frame to machine up the required anti-torque bracket. Fine for you down their but too much hassle for me. I tried to convince them to just sell me the stuff and I would do any machining myself but they wouldn't.

I then contacted Jeff Jones who advised me to stick with 1x10 or go singlespeed......

There is a thread on this forum somewhere which covers Rohloffs in some detail

[Dave Barter]

Now Phil’s on them as well

[Jamesh]

Big Rohloff fan, though not used in my current bikepacking stable. Mine is built into a 26" expedition style bike (vbrakes and standard spacing) so now semi retired.
If I was going to build a designated dirt road rigid tourer (think Ogre/Ecr type thing) and heading out on a long trip I'd go there again (funds permitting)
Simply for the durability, protection from dirt/water and the treat of shifting as many gears as you like on the spot. I reckon a Rohloff paired with a stainless steel front ring would probably last forever
Maintenance is super easy. I put a single 18k mile trip in mine and just changed the oil roughly every 5,000km. This being a 10 minute job with a syringe kit. Half way in that trip I flipped the rear sprocket too.

You certainly get more life out of a chain, but as it stretches you need to take up this slack. So your frame needs some form of sliding dropout or EBB. Pretty sure they come in all the spacings but depending what frame you have will determine the mounting version (think 4 different variants)

On a bike with trail aspirations as well as bikepacking duties I'd probably stick to my 11-46 or maybe look at Eagle, just in consideration to the weight in one mass in the rear

[pistonbroke]

As you know, I've got a standard 14 speed hub bolted to my Van Nicholas 29er and I love it. If you're looking to run one on your Ti frame, as with many cycling questions, the answer is, it depends. I was lucky and found a Van Nic Redwood frame that was the one and only model year that it came with a horizontal slotted dropout so the issue of chain tension had an elegant solution rather than the clunky pulley tensioner that most frames without ebb's are forced to use. The ease of getting the wheel in and out is also a function of where the brake caliper sits and ones mounted inside the rear triangle can be a pain to free enough chain to get the hub out. It's also an issue to position the torque arm neatly and there are several options ranging from a detachable arm that fixes to the chainstay and looks very agricultural to a forked casting that slides over a lug on the frame. The standard setup uses a gripshift style shifter, the indexing is done inside the hub so the shifter is merely a push-me-pull-you twin cable which only needs to be kept taught. There are trigger type alternatives available at enormous cost from Cinq5 which still need 2 cables. The range is equivalent to an old 3×9 setup at about 520% and I find using a 34 chainring about right for the long steep stuff round here. Sheldon Brown's gear calculator is your friend here. The feel of riding can be described as laid back, you have to think forward a bit more and not give the lever a big press if you get caught out needing a lower gear, it can feel a bit spongey. The main issue cited about having a big lump of metal over the back wheel making the bike feel dead is not an issue if you're fully loaded, I actually prefer riding mine with luggage. Living where you do I'd get myself to St John's Street Cycles in Bridgwater and pick their considerable brains, they are the UKs biggest fitter of Roh5loff on their Thorn touring bike. In summary, if I was going to set off around the world tomorrow, I'd want a bike with a Rohloff.
Edit, to answer your questions, they're fairly impervious to clag and pretty waterproof, they keep oil in so should keep most things out.

[Ian]

We have a Rohloff in the family, but it's on Beth's bike, not mine. I've had a go on it a few times and it is smooth and predictable, easy to maintain (Beth does her own oil changes) and plenty of range in the gears. My only gripe is all the weight out back, but if you have a suspension fork fitted at the front (and possibly a dynamo too), balance is restored. All that goes out of the window once you put bags on anyway.

Diverging off the main topic slightly, it's also set up with a Gates belt drive, and a Problem Solvers Eccentric 46 BB thingy to keep it all tight (the belt doesn't stretch anyway). Some people on here may say not to go near belt drive, but we've not had any issues. Gates are picky on the range of frames they approve as being stiff enough to take a belt in the first place - which Shand are. You need a special carrier for the belt sprocket, which isn't available to purhcase just anywhere, so the shop selling it can validate the frame as being up to the task. Too much lateral movement stresses the belt, and they are prone to snapping, I believe.

[Dave Barter]

Thank you sensible people and that's a great idea re: St Johns Duncan.

[quimarche]

I've got a Rohloff on my steel ECR and love it, but chose 1x11 on the newer gravel bike.

Pros. 500% range, just choose your cogs accordingly. Easy to maintain, one oil change a year. Steel bits and a straight chain line mean minimal wear. Finding a shifting solution that works for you can be a pain. Stay away from Cinq5 - they're made of cheese. Gebla Rohbox is where it's at if you don't want a twist-shift. Plenty of adapters depending on drop-outs; I use a Surly Tuggnut to keep the tension on.

Cons. Lots of online comments regarding weight, weight distribution, pedalling noise, shift slickness & price; find one, take it for a spin and make up your own mind.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Thank you sensible people

No trouble Dave.

[pistonbroke]

Thank you sensible people

I resemble that remark, it's just that Stu beat me to it.

Another thought, the cables to the gripshifters arc in such a way as to intefere with most close fitting bar bags, I solved this by using noodles off V brakes to sharpen the curve.

Talk of the Rohbox reminded me that there's a drop bar solution to shifting using a SRAM Red hydro shifter. Seem to remember it was the setup Guy Martin used on the Tour Divide, pity he couldn't navigate as well. There's also a full electric shifting hub available now if you've got North of £2k burning a hole in your pocket.

[ripio]

Big Rohloff fan here, had one on touring bike for about 8 years.
But for off road bikepacking which may involve river crossings etc it may not be suitable due to the possibility of water ingress.
From the Rohloff user manual :

IMG_20190115_210818.jpg (30.92 KiB) Viewed 4718 times

I have carried mine on the back of the car in heavy rain often enough with no issues though.

Also see this from a packrafting forum: http://packrafting.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=1821

[JohnClimber]

Love mine, It's about 5 years old, 7000+ miles on the clock.
It's only on it's 2nd chain and cogs in that time (the original belt drive died within a 500 miles before I ditched such a silly idea)

[Dave Barter]

That water issue might be the deal breaker. Any other comments on it?

[lune ranger]

I got my first Rohloff in 1999 and it is still running strong on its 3rd bike.
I we have 3 and I set one up with a Rohbox on drops last year.
I prize reliability in all mechanical objects and Rohloff's are impressively reliable.
Very functional engineering and clean lines with the right set up.
A specific frame is better but not necessary, they work just fine with the torque arm set up and a chain tensioner. If I had a frame I loved I'd stick a Rohloff on it without question but the simplicity of the system is brought out best either with an EBB or sliding dropouts. I have one on a Surly with horizontal drop outsand this is my least favourite solution. Wheel changes are a pita with a tugnut and releasing the disk caliper. A standard frame and chain tensioner imo was easier to use. I recommend EBB or sliders any day.
All modifications in design thus far have been reverse compatible.
Mine have been submerged in countless rivers in 4 continents.
Over the 520% gear range you can cope fine with most terrain. The actual size of gear can be tiny or massive.
I honestly can't think of a reason why you wouldn't set up a bikepacking bike with a Rohloff... unless you went for a Pinion 18

[pistonbroke]

I think this is Rohloff being very cautious, I've never thought about water ingress but don't generally see much anyway . They also specify minimum chainring size to avoid putting too much torque through the hub but I think this is massively erring on the side of caution as well. They are very well engineered and the go too setup for many round the world trips. I bet SJS have never opened one and found water inside. Worth asking though.

[lune ranger]

Water issue,
What water issue?
I ride through rivers with mine all the time.
Like I say one of mine is almost 20 years old. It's now on a commuter but in the past was on my main tourer. It's crossed Iceland and there were slot of rivers.
If you were concerned about water you could simply do an oil change after the dunking.
Salt water may be an issue long term but I've not really encountered that.

[Hamish]

I have a Rohloff on a Troll. It has been on Thorn Ravens and a Woodrup and is about 10 years old. I don't use it as much now as I'm usually on my Pugsley or Tour de Fer.

I like it but I am still not sure that I absolutely love it.

Pros: predictable and reliable. Gear changes always smooth and immediate. Good range. No dangly bits.... The usual pros. It is great for standing on the pedals up hill for a spell then changing down and spinning for a bit then changing up and standing again. It avoids loads of indexing and obselecence issues. The weight and weight distribution doesn't bother me at all.

Cons: my commute is really sandy so is awful for chains. The chains wear fast. Faster than the sprockets, so over a bad winter the chain 'stretches' faster than the sprocket wears, gets baggy on the sprocket teeth and feels awful. The only solutions are to change both as the sprocket won't accept a new chain = expensive, find a part worn chain that the sprocket accepts or to change chains frequently before they stretch. In short, the system is not wear proof and my chains seem to last longer on my Tour de Fer, probably because the cassettes wear with the chain. The noise in low gears can be annoying. I have had loose bearings and so a sloppy rear wheel. That was solved by sending it back to Germany. It took ten days and was free.

I am not sure whether to keep the Troll and Rohloff. I'd like bigger wheels as I find the 26" wheels a bit bumpy and slow now... But that may be because that's what I expect them to be!? What I would really like is to use the hub on a Tumbleweed Prospector....

[Jurassic pusher]

My Singular Swift is sometimes Single speed and sometimes a Rohloff, It doesn`t take a lot to make the switch.
It does however, seem to completely change the character of the bike!
S/S it is a carefree teenager looking for fun and not worried about tomorrow, swap over to being a Rohloff bike and then it starts wanting to watch Antiques Roadshow and moaning about the price of tea bags.
When it is in Rohloff mode it is a hugely capable and practicle bike,just not so much fun.

[sean_iow]

I've no experience of geared hubs but I would say that you definitely need a frame with either track ends, sliding/alternator drop-outs or an EBB.

My experience of chain tensioners is that they were just as susceptible to water/mud as a rear mech. When I got my Genesis frame I was going through a 'geared' phase so didn't worry about chain tension. After about 4 rides I decided to go back to ss.

I tried a magic ratio which worked until the chain wore.
I had a bb mounted tensioner which worked in the dry but it had a plastic roller and in the wet/mud the chain slides over it instead of rotating it and just wears a grove in the roller making it D shaped
I also had a rear mounted tensioner but that also had a plastic roller that didn't rotate well in the wet but with the added advantage that you had to take the whole thing off to get the wheel out and also the shape of my drop-outs restricted the range of adjustment.

In the end I couldn't put up with any of them any longer and I cut the threaded bb shell out of the frame and welded in a new shell for a EBB (there's a thread on it in MYOG if anyone else wants to go down that route)

The tensioners with the teethed rollers like a jockey wheel might be better but they look a bit fragile so I never tried one.

[lune ranger]

Rohloff chain tensioner is like a modified rear mech. It's quiet in use, sturdy and wears well. The wheels are replaceable.
I have one on a Nicolai full suss that needs it to allow rear wheel travel and it's never given me any problems. My first Rohloff ran for 8 years on an Orange P7 with the same tensioner that I currently use on the Nicolai.
Avoid standard horizontal drop outs. Rohloff do not recommend them. Surly dropouts work but my experience of them on a Krampus is less than satisfying. Other people have no misgivings. My favourite interface is my Thorn eXXp with EBB and OEM 1 dropouts. I've just built a Fargo with sliding dropouts and OEM 1 and can't comment long term but am satisfied with how it's built up.

[sean_iow]

Rohloff chain tensioner is like a modified rear mech. It's quiet in use, sturdy and wears well. The wheels are replaceable.

How does it cope with mud? I like the look of that to ss my commuter/gravel bike. When I was having issues with the tensioners I tried before I discounted it as I didn't want to spend £60 on a tensioner for a £200 frame only for it to join the others in the spares box. In the end I spent nearly £200 on a bb shell and EBB instead

[lune ranger]

Fine Sean. It sits pretty high so is mostly out of the clag.
Some of my favourite riding when I had the tensioner on the P7 was axles deep in Pennine clag.
It'll have its limits for sure but it doesn't get clogged easily or slip or anything like that.
It's slightly more difficult to remove the wheel than a derailleur but you can still do a quick wheel change.
If you wanted to consider a used one I may have one in the shed.