compatibility woes

[simon72]

Long story, but I am trying to fit a 1x11 drive chain to a hybrid frame and it is rejecting it. Seems the BB to rear axel measurement is 420mm on the hybrid, compared to the 450mm on the frame it came from. I have shortened the chain which helped however it just isn't running smoothly enough to even try riding it. Any idea what is going on here, is it possible I am doing something wrong or is the shorter measurement perhaps incompatible with a 1x11?

[Bearbonesnorm]

Is it the same in every gear?

Is it a new chain and new cassette?

[Zippy]

Stiff link? Too short a chain would just stop you using the larger sprockets in the cassette.

[simon72]

the whole 1x11drive chain is almost brand new. It feel like I am running a 10spd shifter with 8spd cassette - gear jumping all over the place, difficult to tune. When riding in the largest rear cog, the chain is at such an aggressive angle it is grinding on cog and the jockey wheels. Thinking about it, I wonder if shortening the distance between front ring and rear cassette is distorting the geometry the 1x11 was designed to work under. It is only 30mm but clearly enough to make a difference.

[ScotRoutes]

What kind of BB is it?
What width is it?
How many spacers do you have?

You may be able to move spacers from drive to non-drive side, thereby reducing the chain angle. Make sure you've enough clearance between the chainring and the chainstay if you do this.

Also - you've not ended up with a Boost chainset? - and what size of chainring are you using?

[Pete-G]

As above, sounds like a chainline issue. I presume its a 135mm back end bike or is it a 130mm rear axle with a MTB spaced crank?

[psling]

More information needed! Is it a complete new drive train i.e. shifters, cables, BB & Cranks, Rear derailleur, cassette, chain and were they all compatible and working well on the donor bike?
The chainstay length is not the problem so dismiss that. As Scotroutes says, from the info you've given it sounds like a BB axle / chainline issue. Once you're happy with that then it sounds like an issue with setting up the rear mech; are levers, cable length & routing, and mech all compatible?

[psling]

Oh, and it is an 11 speed hub you're putting the cassette onto, not trying to put it on a 9/10 speed freehub?

[In Reverse]

Oh, and it is an 11 speed hub you're putting the cassette onto, not trying to put it on a 9/10 speed freehub?

I wasn't aware this was a thing - I haven't had a problem running 10 and 11 speed cassettes on the same freehub.

[Zippy]

I haven't had a problem running 10 and 11 speed cassettes on the same freehub.

11 is a pinch longer, 9/10 speed cassettes need a spacer on an 11 speed freehub. Spline pattern and lockring thread is the same.
If you put 9/10 speed cassettes on 11 speed freehub, it won't be tightened in properly - it confused me for a bit once wondering what had happened when of done this before realising I had an 11 speed freehub!

[Ben98]

I haven't had a problem running 10 and 11 speed cassettes on the same freehub.

11 is a pinch longer, 9/10 speed cassettes need a spacer on an 11 speed freehub. Spline pattern and lockring thread is the same.
If you put 9/10 speed cassettes on 11 speed freehub, it won't be tightened in properly - it confused me for a bit once wondering what had happened when of done this before realising I had an 11 speed freehub!

But 11 speed MTB cassettes fit on 10 speed freehubs (except SRAM XD of course) remember

[In Reverse]

An 11sp cassette on a 10sp hub would work fine in that case?

I'm fairly sure Shimano cassettes are the same width whether 9, 10 or 11. And aren't Hope hub bodies the same width?

[psling]

Yes, sorry, was a bit misleading what I asked above about freehubs. Shimano MTB would be compatible but Shimano road not. Should have asked if the rear wheel being used is off the hybrid and if it's a mtb hub or road hub but, of course, an 11 speed mtb cassette wouldn't go over the taller splines on a 9/10 speed road hub anyway so a complete red herring really! Just ignore me...

Should probably have asked what brand and model all the 1 x 11 bits and all the other donor bits are to check compatibility.

[simon72]

Yes I think chainline issues are the thing here. There is a spacer in the BB that I hadn't noticed. Having now done some research I didn't realise the chainline was so sensitive.

Anyway, I had hoped this would be a quick easy job but now am rethinking the whole approach here. Why am I putting a 1x11 on my rigid computer bike whilst running a 3x10 on my full sus?

I figure I may as well put the new 1x11 on the MtB and the 3x10 on the hybrid. Lots of fun ahead switching over the freehubs etc etc. No doubt I'll be back with more rookie questions.

Thanks for all your help and advice so far.

[ScotRoutes]

Why am I putting a 1x11 on my rigid computer bike whilst running a 3x10 on my full sus?

That's what I'd probably do, depending on my commute. My FS is for tackling much steeper stuff than any commute I've ever done and the commuter would be doing more miles (often in shitty, salty conditions) so would benefit from the simpler drive train.

[simon72]

So.. the reason the 1x11 wasn't working on the new frame was because the derailleur hanger was bent.. Took 5 minutes to fix, once I got hold of this special tool thingy (I didn't know this tool even existed until today)

Untitled by SW, on Flickr

[Zippy]

once I got hold of this special tool thingy (I didn't know this tool even existed until today)

I bought one of those the other day! First time I've actually needed to bend a mech handr beyond what I can do by eye