TDR 2017

[GregMay]

Rickie riding away from Como.

[Scattamah]

I dropped maybe 20-30' past the GoldDust trailhead before I realised. It's not very well signed and not exactly a carved trail - it was quite patchy with grass when I went down there. Once over the creek though and into the forest, the berms...they were fun...not so much the sharp left handers that come after them.

Greetz

S.

[GregMay]

I dropped maybe 20-30' past the GoldDust trailhead before I realised. It's not very well signed and not exactly a carved trail - it was quite patchy with grass when I went down there. Once over the creek though and into the forest, the berms...they were fun...not so much the sharp left handers that come after them.

Greetz

S.

I rode across - literally - one of the guys who rolled in ahead of me on one of those tight corners. We were out running a storm off the top!

[GregMay]

Rickie has turned around. Good to see.

[ianfitz]

How do you miss the golddust trail if you have a GPS? I get that if you were using maps you probably would, but if you read up on the route and were aware of it... I guess some garmins don't give off course warnings too.

Cold. Dark. You ride off the top. Tired. Look down once when zoomed in. Make an assumption it goes this way. Down the gravel, past the turn, coast and eat. Look again 2 mins later, you've descended so far it's back on course on the lower section.

It could happen. It does happen. But most realise, ride back up, or self relegate in Como.

But it's a mistake that is well documented over the years, it's known that you have to take it, it's only optional if your NoBo.

Thanks to the wonder of the internet and dots I spotted she may have been staying at South Park hotel/como rating house.

Sent a FB message which David picked up at 3:15am local time! She'd already left but I think he must have chased her to down as she's turned around and is headed back

Looks like David has saved her race. Incredible level of support from them

[GregMay]

Nice one. Hopefully it'll be a reminder to check her route. Few more tricky sections coming up in NM, but possibly going to be bypassed due to the fires in the Gila.

In other news, the leader is on the shitty road section through the res after Cuba.

DSC00846.jpg by Greg.May, on Flickr

I managed to see:

• a lot of empty beer and vodka bottles,
  a car getting chased by the cops drive off the road and roll before the occupant ran away,
  and had two pittbuls set on me by laughing locals. It was a highlight of my day.
  The one shaded spot beside the open cast coal mine

DSC00848.jpg by Greg.May, on Flickr

Memorable day for me as I had assumed I was going to be scratching when I arrived in Grants at the other end.

[Bearbonesnorm]

Thanks to the wonder of the internet and dots I spotted she may have been staying at South Park hotel/como rating house.

Sent a FB message which David picked up at 3:15am local time! She'd already left but I think he must have chased her to down as she's turned around and is headed back

Looks like David has saved her race. Incredible level of support from them

Is that strictly within the self-supported ethos?

[ianfitz]

Thanks to the wonder of the internet and dots I spotted she may have been staying at South Park hotel/como rating house.

Sent a FB message which David picked up at 3:15am local time! She'd already left but I think he must have chased her to down as she's turned around and is headed back

Looks like David has saved her race. Incredible level of support from them

Is that strictly within the self-supported ethos?

I don't know. She didn't ask me to do it I chose to.

I'd do the same for anyone if I spotted it.

If it ends up in a DQ that's fine as she would have been facing one anyway.

[mountainbaker]

I managed to see:

• a lot of empty beer and vodka bottles,
  a car getting chased by the cops drive off the road and roll before the occupant ran away,
  and had two pittbuls set on me by laughing locals. It was a highlight of my day.
  The one shaded spot beside the open cast coal mine

I liked that section, after an incredibly tough day through Polvadera Mesa on 2L of water and that sand-rock-sand sub standard, it was luxury to have paved roads and a full stomach from Cuba. The mercantile/laundromat before Pueblo Pintado was brill, we got pizzas there, and the local reservation people were super friendly and we had some long chats about the 'checkerboard' reservation land assignments and how they have been totally fecked over. They were hopeful of Obama repealing this system (where they got a checkerboard of land, so not contiguous) and also, the worst land around for cultivating anything.

The dogs that chased us just before ended up at the mercantile and were quite friendly!

The lowlight of the day for me was arriving in Milan/Grants and being in a proper sh!thole.

That tunnel by the open cast mine was a godsend! Sat in there for at least 30 mins. Then Kiwi Dave rode in after us, did a massive fart that echoed and we all had a good giggle.

[GregMay]

Yeah I've heard such mixed reports from that section. It's really strange. Maybe I just got there on a bad day.

Saying that, when I was feasting on fried chicken at the Loves in Milan I got talking to two women off the res. Spent about 20 mins talking about their lives, what they do, how it is difficult to get by there but that they love seeing us ride through. They also let me know that Jackie was told not to bivi by some of the elder women in Cuba and that they'd offer to come out to check on her during the night as she rode through.

Real juxtaposition of people I met there.

Grants is ok, some of the other R66 towns are way worse - Gallup being one. I met up with Dan agian in Grants, we went to Walmart, bought some beer and slept in a motel shooting the sub standard till way to late. Was a good night. Mainly as I knew I may have a chance to fix my very borked bike in Albuquerque the next day. And I had my first shower in 8 days :)

[Cheeky Monkey]

Thanks to the wonder of the internet and dots I spotted she may have been staying at South Park hotel/como rating house.

Sent a FB message which David picked up at 3:15am local time! She'd already left but I think he must have chased her to down as she's turned around and is headed back

Looks like David has saved her race. Incredible level of support from them

Is that strictly within the self-supported ethos?

I wondered that too. Being self-supported but having your nav' error corrected by someone over the internet in a whole other continent seems ?wrong?

Hey ho, it's just riding bikes and all

[jameso]

How do you miss the golddust trail if you have a GPS? I get that if you were using maps you probably would

I did, using maps - missed it and went up and down for 30 mins or more looking for the turn off. Riding on cues only around Breckenridge and Steamboat bike paths lost me hours of missed route retraces.

Ianfitz - it is against the regs to contact a rider and notify them of a route error, strictly speaking (and I'm not, not my place to, just pointing it out). Although when not requested it's one for debate. Could be said that riders should take responsibility to tell friends and family about this before racing. For this type of reason among others the GDR had a no-phone rule. Matt Lee has regulated the bikepacking.net forum for people pointing out route errors on there as it's known that riders browse as they ride.

I know first-hand how outside influence like this can affect things directly, but then again it didn't affect my ride (just those I was racing 'against' or at a long stretch of the imagination maybe my end placing) so I don't actually care. It does suprise me how little of the original self-supported ethics are known among many racers now though. Dangerous ground .. rule pedantry vs not really giving one for racing itself either : ) (but if you're going to race, read up and race well, right?)

[whitestone]

Nothing new really - here's a view from five years ago http://tobygadd.blogspot.co.uk/2012/05/ ... rules.html His "rules", guidelines or however you wish to describe them are much more complete than the usual set that appear on many sites. While some can be absolutes some have grey areas and can be hard to police - this year's AZT had a trail closure that occurred *after* the race had started so getting that information to riders could have been seen as outside help.

Bystanders can’t assist you in any way whatsoever, so you must refuse their offers of water, food, parts, and other supplies.

I even refused a kiss from my wife when she came out to support near the end of the first YD300

[jameso]

Toby Gadd is an extremist when it comes to self-supported : ) fully respect his stand on it though and in many ways absolutes are the only rules that can be policed. Follow the conclusions through and it might get more difficult to work that way I think. I find Matt Lee's take on things like trail magic more realistic, probably in part because I identify with his approach to riding/racing more.

[Scattamah]

Outside support is prohibited last time I checked. The only support you can get (and i missed this in 2014) is if you have a mechanical, you can ring a family member and they can purchase the part and have it expressed to you. You still make the part change/tune accordingly, under your own steam (or take the part to a bike shop on route as it's open to all racers and have it fitted). This may have changed since I last read the rules.

What Ian did isn't outside the rules. What David might have done (difficult to say if David influenced Rickie or she's turned around herself) would break the rules and a DQ or relegation might occur.

Greetz

S.

[GregMay]

It's a tricky one trail magic. Does Brush MTN lodge count as magic as Kirsten will not bill you, only accepts donations? It's not a commercial transaction. No is my opinion.

Does the kid who hands you a bar as you look hungry count? Or the guy in the 4x4 in the Basin who see's you're running low on water and gives you a gallon from his car count? No is my opinion.

Does ringing people for info while en route, or looking at Track leaders for other riders position, or asking others ahead of you for rider positions and times count? Yes is my opinion. To whit, my phone was in my bag and off until Cuba when I thought I was scratching. I never activly sought info on others. It happens that riders do. Their choice I suppose. Just not for me.

Does posting things to social media when en route count? No, once you don't interact, just post out to the void. However, I know Matt disagrees with this.

The community has always self regulated. I'm sure it will do so in this case.

EDIT for clarity - and yes, Mr Gadd is an extreme example

[whitestone]

I kept my phone off for most of the time during this year's HT550. The only person I was likely to ring was my wife and she was touring the distilleries on Islay so was going to be out of contact for much of the BH weekend anyway! I'd also asked her not to tell me anything about other riders or the event in general unless it was something serious. I only looked at trackleaders once when in Lochinver to confirm that my SPOT wasn't working, until told I didn't know it hadn't been transmitting up until that point. I did post on here about the same problem.

I ended up texting Greg about my SPOT, pure fluke that his reply (only received once I got to Ullapool) didn't actually say what the problem was but triggered a memory/thought which got it working. Thanks again Greg! It was a slight worry up to that point about heading into Fisherfield without that safety net but I'd have continued even if I hadn't sorted it out.

My intention was to be off-grid, I was racing the route not other riders so knowing where they were was irrelevant, no need to put myself into the red just to try and catch someone. I was surprised how many riders I saw after the first day as apart from the main resupply stops I didn't think I'd see any but most of the time I was on my own, I was happy with that. (not a miserable bugger, honest!)

[GregMay]

I ended up texting Greg about my SPOT, pure fluke that his reply (only received once I got to Ullapool) didn't actually say what the problem was but triggered a memory/thought which got it working. Thanks again Greg! It was a slight worry up to that point about heading into Fisherfield without that safety net but I'd have continued even if I hadn't sorted it out.

There is a reason I reply to texts during the HTR like I do. You're welcome.

The reply I gave to a rider who askd "Where is the nearest train station" while on the Norhtern Loop may not have been what they wanted: If I tell you you'll be disqualified and disappointed, lets just say it's not within a days ride of your current point. In a straight line.

[touch]

Does ringing people for info while en route, or looking at Track leaders for other riders position, or asking others ahead of you for rider positions and times count? Yes is my opinion.

His rules seem a bit contradictory on this point for me.

Before the race starts, it's OK to read trip reports, borrow gear lists, create cue sheets, analyze GPX data, swap strategy secrets, etc.

Don't log into BlueDot.mobi, TrackLeaders.com, or other race-tracking sites. Not in towns or with smartphones.

I dont see the difference between knowing where you are in relation to historical finishers and knowing where you are in relation to 'live' competitors. Everyone is riding individually and your finish time is going to be compared against those who have already completed it as well as those who started the GD with you.

[GregMay]

EDIT: - forgot to answer this:I dont see the difference between knowing where you are in relation to historical finishers and knowing where you are in relation to 'live' competitors.

it allows you to make decisions on sleeping, stopping, or pushing on depending on where those around you are.

Either way, Gadds rules are his opinion. The stated rules of the TD are here:

http://tourdivide.org/the_rules

The issue as ever lies with this one: Outside assistance is defined as any third party assistance in navigation or lighting and any non-commercial assistance in food resupply and/or lodging.

For me, looking at trackleaders during the race is third party assistance. Others opinions my vary.

If you want to have a discussion about the rules people over on Bikepacking.net will happily engage in it. I'm going back to enjoying watching people having fun.

[whitestone]

How does information about diversions/deviations get to the riders once on route? Even for those at the front a lot can happen between the GD and getting down to the southern areas. The fire south of Pie Town you posted about for example.

[Scattamah]

Matt will text you any diversions. It's up to you to check your phone for these messages when signal is available. He will also get in touch with people along the route where possible to inform. Whilst strictly speaking, it's 3rd-party help, Matt allows it as it's a safety issue.

Greetz

S.

[SteveM]

http://forums.mtbr.com/bikepacking-bike ... 47630.html

some interesting early days stuff here

just realised this is the same story as James posted earlier, different forum though

[GregMay]

Mike C has posted some more stuff on his blog of late. It's really cool to hear some of his stories. Guy has so much in that head of his that I'd love to see on paper.

*scoops out his brains*
*puts on paper*

This wasn't what I expected...

[GregMay]

Apparently Stefan is out, bearings have collapsed. Real shame.